Mr Matt Foley Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 Beautiful work and thanks for all of the updates John. It is a privilege to watch and learn your skills as you move forward with the build. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mstor Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 7 hours ago, John Wolstenholme said: Underside prepared for the Eduard photoetched parts. Will not fix them until fuselage halves are ready to be joined, or are joined, due to flex How do you get the PE inserts perfectly flush with no gaps at all around them? I am just amazed. Its like they were always there and you just painted them. 😲 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted August 28, 2018 Author Share Posted August 28, 2018 (edited) As with all my builds. The only way sometimes, spend hours thinking, trying things and executing the solution. It’s a bit like fitting the Aires cockpit set. I don’t just rush in with a power tool or razor saw. I then prefer the control with files, sanding sticks and the sand, fit, sand, fit, …………….. With all the handling (cockpit fitting, filling panel lines, thinning raised detail, removing the sink line just behind the L.Es) of the upper fuselage, the ‘guard rail’ to the sensor probes fatigued, not unlike me. An easy solution. It is after all a skunk works black project. Oh, we're back, must have been a host problem. Edited August 28, 2018 by John Wolstenholme Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zaxos345 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 I follow the same way John!!! Great job my friend!!! John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chek Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 On 8/24/2018 at 1:42 PM, John Wolstenholme said: This is interesting. Fortunately it is apparent in photos of the acft I am modelling which version I should have, as both can be seen in 2003. Hey John, it's coming along well - love all the routed out mesh inserts. I believe that the difference in the two photos above is that the 2000 photo on the left is of YF-117 79-10781 at the USAF museum, Dayton, whereas the 2003 photo is of a production model with an 80 to 88 FY prefixed serial. The 4 serrations on the upper edge of the FLIR turret aperture remained constant, AFAIK. The only problem with that theory, is that I've a shot of F-117A 84-0812 with the six serrations as per the USAFM example., but it seems to be an exception according to the photos I've collected. However given that production ended in 1988 and it was in action in the Middle East until 2003, and the USA until 2008, it's possible some cannibalising of older airframes was required to keep a fleet operational. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted August 29, 2018 Author Share Posted August 29, 2018 14 minutes ago, chek said: given that production ended in 1988 and it was in action in the Middle East until 2003, and the USA until 2008, it's possible some cannibalising of older airframes was required to keep a fleet operational. As you say Charles, 82-0802, July 2003 https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/8531036 Regards John. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted August 29, 2018 Author Share Posted August 29, 2018 To something equally ‘interesting’. Looking in the Sq. Signal Walkaround, I note “the mesh screen in front of the FLIR assembly appears to be a solid at first glance”. Indicating there is no glass? Additionally, when looking at: https://imgproc.airliners.net/photos/airliners/9/1/5/0424519.jpg https://imgproc.airliners.net/photos/airliners/7/6/3/1268367.jpg light reflections on all the glass surfaces are evident, except on the FLIR aperture. So, was there not an ingress of water when flying in rain! What about bird strikes! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chek Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 (edited) Funny you should mention bird strikes John, as that was the main reason I could think of for replacing that aperture panel. As for the turret itself, it would only rotate its sensor window forward on the run in for the attack, and birds would be very rare at the altitude the plane would operate at. Presumably rain would be cleared via diverted air vents like the windscreen. This picture does catch the mesh better than most others. Irritatingly, it's actually coarser than that fabric glare filter I used in the 1/72 Nighthawk I built. F-117A 88-0841 HO 9 FS Berlin June 2000 by Burkhard Domke Edited August 29, 2018 by chek photo credit added Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted September 1, 2018 Author Share Posted September 1, 2018 Photos back again, for how long this time? It is strange how there is such a contrast between the above photo Charles posted and this screen shot from a video: The described ‘fine mesh’ is barely visible, no obvious square, hexagon etc pattern. Looks like wrinkles in the centre! Moving onto the intake grilles, what was the thinking was behind the solid plastic version with the double glazed window frame look? Nice fit though. The P.E. version is finely detailed, but PE is going to be thin. As they say, change what you can, accept what you cannot. The deep plastic at the top behind the grille had to go. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chek Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, John Wolstenholme said: It is strange how there is such a contrast between the above photo Charles posted and this screen shot from a video: The described ‘fine mesh’ is barely visible, no obvious square, hexagon etc pattern. Looks like wrinkles in the centre! Morning John! I regret to say that your build has piqued an interest in the the olde Nighthawk, and I was just trying to hunt down the last outstanding photo of the 64 F-117s built. A couple are beyond finding due to being early losses, but 85-0824 is elusive, despite a few mislabelled ones of 84-0824 out there. But enough of that. The problem with your video still is one of format and resolution. As it's a USAF aircraft, I'm deducing it's a video frame from an american video in NTSC format with a resolution of 720 x 486, judging by the 'stepping' visible on the upper left serration above the FLIR turret, and to lesser degrees elsewhere in the picture. Additionally, the format introduces some smoothing functions in the algorithm (hence the bogus 'wrinkle' impression) in order to produce a 'lifelike' visual experience. As such, it's not really designed to extract fine detail from a still frame such as would be possible from a much finer grained wet film movie still. Trying to insist that you can, powered a slew of increasingly far-fetched 9/11 conspiracy theories a decade or so ago. The still below is from an original jpeg at 3145 x 2247 resolution, and shows the mesh detail more clearly (click to enlarge, then click on the image again). 1 hour ago, John Wolstenholme said: Moving onto the intake grilles, what was the thinking was behind the solid plastic version with the double glazed window frame look? Nice fit though. The P.E. version is finely detailed, but PE is going to be thin. As they say, change what you can, accept what you cannot. The deep plastic at the top behind the grille had to go. What the kit designer probably had in mind was trying to represent the 3-D nature of the intake baffles, as illustrated in the diagram below: Farr from being a simple mesh affair, the baffles are more akin to the 'pyramids' seen in an anechoic chamber, and serve the same purpose, i.e. to attenuate any radar signal and its reflection. But until such times as nano scale home 3-D printing is available, I'd say PE mesh is our current best option. P.S. - I saw some spiffy looking prismatic film available from Hasegawa that might work well on the canopy clear panels. Edited September 1, 2018 by chek spelling Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted September 1, 2018 Author Share Posted September 1, 2018 Hi Charles, many thanks for your input. I was with you all the way regarding the video until “the format introduces some smoothing functions in the algorithm”. Regarding the inlet grilles, I was aware of the ‘construction’ thereby requiring those ~1m long secondary inlet doors for taxying and low speed. Cannot see anybody coming up with a PE or resin part which doesn’t look even more un-scale like. But, never say never. I note the painting instructions state matt black for the intake trunking, normally white for inspection purposes. Presumably required by those big secondary doors when open in flight. May do the front black and the rear section white. In any event it would look at bit naff seeing a white intake through the P.E. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chek Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 29 minutes ago, John Wolstenholme said: Hi Charles, many thanks for your input. I was with you all the way regarding the video until “the format introduces some smoothing functions in the algorithm”. Apologies John, it's just a fancy way of saying the pixel signals are processed by the video encoder in such a way as to show a smooth (usually) moving image. The upshot being that the picture is not optimised for crisp still images - quite the opposite, in fact. The mesh itself is just too fine to be detected properly at that resolution, although something like localised brighter reflections look to have been smoothed into the image and appeared as the 'wrinkle' on the FLIR turret. What's commonly called an 'artefact', i.e. it wasn't really there, the process itself made it appear. 37 minutes ago, John Wolstenholme said: Regarding the inlet grilles, I was aware of the ‘construction’ thereby requiring those ~1m long secondary inlet doors for taxying and low speed. Cannot see anybody coming up with a PE or resin part which doesn’t look even more un-scale like. But, never say never. I note the painting instructions state matt black for the intake trunking, normally white for inspection purposes. Presumably required by those big secondary doors when open in flight. May do the front black and the rear section white. In any event it would look at bit naff seeing a white intake through the P.E. Having the black front section seems like best bet. The photo below shows not the slightest trace of the liney's yellow smock, nor any interior ducting. I'd hazard a guess that like the MiG-29 and the Su-27, those upper intake doors are only open on the ground and close once flying speed is reached. So the ducts probably are all white for inspection, but for modelling appearances black will look better. Unless you specifically want to show them open, in which case it's your call on how to compromise. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mr Matt Foley Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 3 hours ago, chek said: Apologies John, it's just a fancy way of saying the pixel signals are processed by the video encoder in such a way as to show a smooth (usually) moving image. The upshot being that the picture is not optimised for crisp still images - quite the opposite, in fact. The mesh itself is just too fine to be detected properly at that resolution, although something like localised brighter reflections look to have been smoothed into the image and appeared as the 'wrinkle' on the FLIR turret. What's commonly called an 'artefact', i.e. it wasn't really there, the process itself made it appear. Having the black front section seems like best bet. The photo below shows not the slightest trace of the liney's yellow smock, nor any interior ducting. I'd hazard a guess that like the MiG-29 and the Su-27, those upper intake doors are only open on the ground and close once flying speed is reached. So the ducts probably are all white for inspection, but for modelling appearances black will look better. Unless you specifically want to show them open, in which case it's your call on how to compromise. And here I always thought there was only a single crew member for the F-117. He must feed coal into the engine and I imagine there is another crew member for the other engine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted September 1, 2018 Author Share Posted September 1, 2018 12 minutes ago, Mr Matt Foley said: And here I always thought there was only a single crew member for the F-117. He must feed coal into the engine and I imagine there is another crew member for the other engine. 3 hours ago, chek said: That's the real reason they were black, so the dirt didn't show. All that RAM business was a con. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chek Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 If it was a caption competition, the guy in the intake could be saying: "If you weren't planning to hit the start button, how come you've got your ear defenders on?" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
caudleryan Posted September 2, 2018 Share Posted September 2, 2018 "Are you sure you saw my keys down here?" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted September 3, 2018 Author Share Posted September 3, 2018 Funny diversion. And the winner is……………………….. I decided to redo the compressor front faces. Why? Maybe a little OCD coming thro’. With everything dry fitted in the top fuz with 1” wide rolled white paper at the end of the trunking, it is easily seen when appropriately viewed. So it’s matt black all the way. Now to some airbrushing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Parabat Posted September 3, 2018 Share Posted September 3, 2018 That looks really good, much improved. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
A-10 LOADER Posted September 3, 2018 Share Posted September 3, 2018 Yes, I agree with Parabat, looks much better. Steve Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joel_W Posted September 3, 2018 Share Posted September 3, 2018 John, Just a huge improvement on those compressor blades. Joel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my favs are F`s Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 SO much Beautiful! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John Wolstenholme Posted September 6, 2018 Author Share Posted September 6, 2018 Thanks as always to those of you taking the time to comment. Having spent hours getting the grilles finished, I decided to protect them against inadvertent fingers during handling still to come. Thinned the exhaust nozzles to look more realistic, but it is not as dramatic as the photo indicates. I didn’t notice I placed the top piece upside down for the photo, which is also now thinned so could not redo. Need to get back to the NGB, just got distracted with ideas elsewhere. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackerjazz Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 Your modifications are amazing, John! It's a real treat watching your thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zaxos345 Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 I am with Joe on this John!!! Amazing attention to detail and work!!!!!!! John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slartibartfast Posted September 6, 2018 Share Posted September 6, 2018 Do you know how many bags of popcorn I've eaten as I follow this thread?! Not good for my waistline. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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