11bee Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 (edited) Very interesting article about an advanced version of the F-15. Not so much about the aircraft itself, that info has been in the press for a while. The interesting part is (if you believe the article), that the USAF has recently been pushing for this aircraft. Previously, I just figured it was a longshot sales pitch by BA to keep their F-15 production line staggering on for a few more years. It's an intriguing idea. The F-15 would be more than a missile truck for use by F-22's and F-35's, it's got some pretty impressive capabilities of it's own. And best of all (from the USAF's standpoint), it shouldn't be seen as a threat to their continuing purchases of more F-35's. http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/22372/exclusive-unmasking-the-f-15x-boeings-f-15c-d-eagle-replacement-fighter Sounds like there is actually a chance that this could happen... Edited July 26, 2018 by 11bee Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Whiskey Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 I was reading that and have been keeping up with the news regarding the F-15X program and idea. It makes a lot of sense from differing perspectives, especially since the Air Force can never seem to make up it's mind on what it wants to do. I did like the line about "continuing having to rely on 4th gen aircraft to ensure maximum mission capabilities" or something like that. Reminds me of going back to the whole A-10 subject. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mizar Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 hope is not going to be a twoseater cause I'm tired of them Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted July 26, 2018 Author Share Posted July 26, 2018 6 minutes ago, Mizar said: hope is not going to be a twoseater cause I'm tired of them Nope, single seat. I wonder if I that means the D models will stick around longer or if they’ll eventually also lurches new two seaters? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 I hope Boeing gets their hopes up and then gets the rug pulled out from under them. A good airframe that has modern upgrades that will keep it relevant plus save money. Hmmm, where have I heard that before? Oh yeah, it's when Grumman offered an improved version of the Tomcat that would have modernized that airframe, filled the long range strike mission, and saved money. But Boeing got the Super Hornet through instead. Karma would be great in this case! 😊 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 16 minutes ago, Darren Roberts said: I hope Boeing gets their hopes up and then gets the rug pulled out from under them. A good airframe that has modern upgrades that will keep it relevant plus save money. Hmmm, where have I heard that before? Oh yeah, it's when Grumman offered an improved version of the Tomcat that would have modernized that airframe, filled the long range strike mission, and saved money. But Boeing got the Super Hornet through instead. Karma would be great in this case! 😊 but they could get more beer cans out of the Tom cat frame! Face it the F15 was always a better air frame, and will be till they make beer cans out of them. gary Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BN7149 Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 3 minutes ago, ChesshireCat said: but they could get more beer cans out of the Tom cat frame! Face it the F15 was always a better air frame, and will be till they make beer cans out of them. gary I'd drink that beer... bet it tastes like freedom. -Ryan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Thunderchief105 Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 3 hours ago, BN7149 said: I'd drink that beer... bet it tastes like freedom. -Ryan Or at least like Samuel Adams. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 3 hours ago, ChesshireCat said: but they could get more beer cans out of the Tom cat frame! Face it the F15 was always a better air frame, and will be till they make beer cans out of them. gary I was thinking razors. 😂 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
habu2 Posted July 26, 2018 Share Posted July 26, 2018 Real Beer comes from kegs, not cans. :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 3 hours ago, Thunderchief105 said: Or at least like Samuel Adams. Yingling here gary Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted July 27, 2018 Author Share Posted July 27, 2018 44 minutes ago, ChesshireCat said: Yingling here gary I thought we were talking about beer? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
habu2 Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 1 hour ago, 11bee said: I thought we were talking about beer? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
camus27 Posted July 27, 2018 Share Posted July 27, 2018 The Air Force seems really ambivalent about the F-15. First they were going to upgrade 179 to Golden Eagles, then around 2014 they started deactivating units and getting rid of them, then they were going to keep them until 2040, now they don't know - they might just keep the F-16. This seems like the best plan, supplement the F-35 without relying on its unknown factors, while upgrading a proven air-frame that can handle almost anything. I don't get the 22 missile configuration though, I can see 20 or 24, so I'm not sure of that is a misprint. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
strikeeagle801 Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 16 hours ago, camus27 said: I don't get the 22 missile configuration though, I can see 20 or 24, so I'm not sure of that is a misprint. Based on the same setup on stations 1/9 as 2/8, I get 24...which is a helluva lot of missiles! I have long stated the USAF needs to build more F-15's. I hope they go with this program. I don't know why they would go with single seaters though...They have not built an F-15C since the early 2000's (I think?) and I'm not sure the tooling is still around. I would think since they are still turning out F-15SA's, it would be easier to just build two-seaters. And, an WSO would never hurt with situational awareness, and would allow for multi-mission capability to be kept. Aaron Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waco Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Highly unlikely. Given current acquisition timelines, costs, and associated sustainment cost, the air superiority Eagles days are numbered. Given the current math, the discussion works out something like this: F-15C, A-10, and F-16 — pick 2, cuz one’s gotta go. We cannot afford all these 4th Gen platforms while continuing to modernize. Of those three, one is politically untouchable, and one is in such huge numbers with a massive spares supply line, it’s almost unthinkable to remove it from the inventory. Oh, and it’s multirole... That leaves... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
achterkirch Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/22372/exclusive-unmasking-the-f-15x-boeings-f-15c-d-eagle-replacement-fighter i think it’s a good idea. There isn’t enough F-22’s to go around and even though the F-35 is here it’s not cheap to operate. Combine that and given the fact that the C/D’s we have now need to have costly upgrades at some point in the near future (rewinding) I think it would make sense to just buy new with all the upgrades and then some. This could be why the Air Force cancelled EPAWS on the fighter eagle fleet but kept it on the strike eagle fleet because they were thinking about doing this for a while now. There’s lots of pluses I think to buying the F-15X. Many of them mentioned in the article I linked above. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jpk Posted July 28, 2018 Share Posted July 28, 2018 Geez, what a great idea! Something I was thinking and advocating with my friends for years now. The best example of why is the F-22. So expensive we only made less than 200. We need far more than what was produced. Look at what the Russians do. The SU-27 is almost as old as the F-15 yet the Russians continuously update, upgrade it, change it around. They give it different numbers but it is basically the same aircraft from the mid 70's. Everyone looks at it like it is a new aircraft but it is still a 40 year old airframe and not nearly as good as the F-15. I was wondering why we didn't do the same with the best fighter ever designed since it was still in production? I know everyone likes new and shiny but this only makes so much sense. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waco Posted July 29, 2018 Share Posted July 29, 2018 These new build F-15s have been been proven to cost as much as or more than late lot F-22s and current production F-35s for significantly less capability. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john53 Posted July 29, 2018 Share Posted July 29, 2018 If you add the electronic gobble de goop to an F-15 air frame why is it's proven capability less than an unproven F-22 or F-35. Just curious what are the kill ratios for the F-22 and F-35. Are they proven better? Can they walk the walk or just talk the talk?---John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
strikeeagle801 Posted July 29, 2018 Share Posted July 29, 2018 (edited) 23 hours ago, Waco said: Highly unlikely. Given current acquisition timelines, costs, and associated sustainment cost, the air superiority Eagles days are numbered. Given the current math, the discussion works out something like this: F-15C, A-10, and F-16 — pick 2, cuz one’s gotta go. We cannot afford all these 4th Gen platforms while continuing to modernize. Of those three, one is politically untouchable, and one is in such huge numbers with a massive spares supply line, it’s almost unthinkable to remove it from the inventory. Oh, and it’s multirole... That leaves... Then bring in more F-16 Block 70's then. But I don't see that happening either. Honestly, as much as I would LOVE to see more F-15's built, I agree with you. I don't think new F-15's are going to happen. OR F-16's for that matter. Or new F-22's as some have suggested elsewhere. I think that we've put all our eggs in the F-35 basket. Aaron Edited July 29, 2018 by strikeeagle801 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waco Posted July 29, 2018 Share Posted July 29, 2018 “Are they proven better?” Yes. “Can they walk the walk or just talk the talk?” Proven more effective, survivable, lethal, many times over. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jpk Posted July 29, 2018 Share Posted July 29, 2018 11 hours ago, Waco said: These new build F-15s have been been proven to cost as much as or more than late lot F-22s and current production F-35s for significantly less capability. Boeing has touted a guaranteed fly away price of the F-15X as $95M/copy. They also say they would eat any cost overruns. A restarted F-22 prod line would cost tens of billions of dollars. I'd certainly like to see it reopened but man that is a lot of scratch and with the recent 1.5 trillion dollar tax cut the F-15X looks like a far more financially doable alternative. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
habu2 Posted July 29, 2018 Share Posted July 29, 2018 The "financially doable alternative" is to retire them. E very other alternative costs money, and apparently that money belongs to the F-35 and Shall Not Be Touched. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted July 29, 2018 Author Share Posted July 29, 2018 Given that the military is spending like drunken sailors these days (no offense to my brothers in the Navy), I see no reason why the USAF can't have their cake and eat it too. Plus, unless the gist of the article is wrong, this push is coming from the USAF. It's not a BA sales campaign. If true and the USAF really wants to go this route, I see no reason why it can't happen. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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