viking73 Posted August 2, 2018 Share Posted August 2, 2018 Hello Gents, I know this is a pretty obscure question, but does anyone know what the top/exterior of the astrodome opening looks like or what color it should be? I'm talking about the area that would be visible from under the glass dome of the astrodome. I've got pictures of the bottoms of the opening that I took from the inside of a museum preserved T-29C so I know what they look like from the inside. There was this one (I think the black is just paint that was added when the a/c was retired): And also this type, that is completely closed off it looks like: I need to add a single astrodome to the 1/72 Mach 2 Convair C-131B kit I'm currently working on. The a/c I'm building has one and of course it's not in the kit. I have a nice piece of Evergreen plastic tubing that I think is just the right diameter for the base of the astrodome. I should be able to "heat and smash" form the glass dome from a piece of clear plastic sheet with the end of a dowel rod sanded to shape as my master/pattern. The hardest part will be to correctly center the astrodome on the top I feel. If it's not centered I think it will be very noticeable. Which leads me to another dilemma. I am toying with the best way to add the astrodome to my model. I have two options in mind. I can either drill a hole into the top of the fuselage and slide the Evergreen tube into the fuselage opening I just drilled to make the base, or do I just sand one end of the tube to match the contour of the top of the fuselage and then just glue the tube directly to the top without drilling any holes? That's where I'm at now. Here are a few pictures of my build so far. Here is the first primer coat before I added the windscreen and re-scribed the cargo door on the rear port side. I'm made a few other additions and subtractions to the airframe since this photo was taken: Here's a shot of the newly scribed cargo door, complete with holes for the handles I'll make from lead wire after it's painted. Sorry for the fuzz in the picture: Finally, here is how she sits now, with the windscreen all fared in. I still need to re-scribe some panel lines. Also note the hole on the outside of the engine nacelle - this is a light I'll simulate with an MV Lens after painting. That's about it for now. Once I get the astrodome figured out and added, this bird will be off to the paint shop. Thanks for looking and any information you might have about the astrodome would be appreciated. Or maybe I'm way too worried over this small detail?! 😧 -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Drifterdon Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 Derek, not sure if you got your answer and I don't have the definitive one but a semi-uneducated guess would be flat black in these old birds for doing solar shots during the day. At least that's what I'd paint mine. Would love to see more pics. Don Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 5, 2018 Author Share Posted September 5, 2018 Hi Don, Thanks for the reply. I think you are right about the black. Masking off the circle to paint it should be fun 😁 Here are some shots of it added to the model. I decided to not drill into the top of the fuselage, I simply glued on a length of the plastic tubing I had. It was tall (on purpose to ease handling) and then I simply sanded it down to match the correct height in my reference photos. I added a few bits to detail the interior and shot a coat of primer on to see how it looked. I haven't smash formed the actual dome itself yet out of a piece of some blister pack clear plastic but that shouldn't be too difficult. In this last photo you can see I added a bit of plastic drinking straw bits to improve the kit exhausts that I also drilled out. Here are a few photos earlier in construction where I drilled them out: Thanks again for the reply Don. I'll be sure to post more about my build here soon. It hasn't been an easy road to get to this point for sure. Mach 2 kits usually aren't an easy build as I'm sure some of you know. I'll be marking it as a C-131B of the Texas ANG using photos from the Ginter book, my own collection, and also photos found on the web here: https://www.cloud9photography.us/Military-Aviation-14/ANG-Convair-C-131-Samaritan/ The decals I'll be using are mostly collected from several Caracal Models sheets. -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cubs2jets Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) A quick google search says...most C-131's didn't have an astrodome. Of those pictured that did...there was NO surrounding "anti-glare" panel - everything white. C2j Edited September 5, 2018 by Cubs2jets Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dutch Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) On 8/2/2018 at 6:55 PM, viking73 said: I need to add a single astrodome to the 1/72 Mach 2 Convair C-131B kit I'm currently working on. The a/c I'm building has one and of course it's not in the kit. I have a nice piece of Evergreen plastic tubing that I think is just the right diameter for the base of the astrodome. I should be able to "heat and smash" form the glass dome from a piece of clear plastic sheet with the end of a dowel rod sanded to shape as my master/pattern. The hardest part will be to correctly center the astrodome on the top I feel. If it's not centered I think it will be very noticeable. Which leads me to another dilemma. I am toying with the best way to add the astrodome to my model. I have two options in mind. I can either drill a hole into the top of the fuselage and slide the Evergreen tube into the fuselage opening I just drilled to make the base, or do I just sand one end of the tube to match the contour of the top of the fuselage and then just glue the tube directly to the top without drilling any holes? That's where I'm at now Derek, As an aid to your "heat & smash" astrodome forming, I would suggest the following. Get a short piece (1/2" - 3/4") of tube with an inside diameter that matches the outside diameter of your astrodome base, mount it on a solid base, hollow side up as the "female" part of your mold. Choose a dowel that is slightly (1/16") smaller in diameter than the inside diameter of your astrodome base as the "male" part of your "heat & smash" molding. Place the heated clear plastic over the tube, then press the male dowel slightly deeper into the female "mold" to ensure you have sufficient height on the dome. That way, the "base" of your finished astrodome will have a nice vertical side for mounting on your base. See diagram below. Without the hollow female mold, the clear plastic will just form a "tent" with sides that drape at an angle. R/ Dutch Edited September 5, 2018 by Dutch Add clarity and diagram. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Drifterdon Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, Cubs2jets said: A quick google search says...most C-131's didn't have an astrodome. Of those pictured that did...there was NO surrounding "anti-glare" panel - everything white. C2j He was referring to the area under the clear dome. "I'm talking about the area that would be visible from under the glass dome of the astrodome." The only plane that I've ever seen an anti glare panel around the upper dome was on the RC-135S Rivet Ball (The Mother of all Balls). That was a manual tracking station used for the cameras based on I believe an old B-50 gunsight. Edited September 6, 2018 by Drifterdon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 6, 2018 Author Share Posted September 6, 2018 Thanks gents. Yes, I know there isn't any black around the C-131 astrodome, I was only inquiring about the area that would be visible under the glass. Black might be correct Don, thanks. Interesting RC-135 photo btw... Well I have the top of the fuselage sprayed white. I really hate painting white but I tried a Tamiya rattle can of "pure white" and it seemed to go on okay. I have my Model Master ADC Gray enamel all ready to airbrush on soon... The Convair was a pretty big plane and dwarfs most of my other 1/72 air force 🙂 -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Drifterdon Posted September 7, 2018 Share Posted September 7, 2018 Coming along great Derek. You're certainly beating that Mach 2 Kit into submission. They are almost as bad as building a vac kit. Also love the SAC Mitchell in the background. TB-25 or VB-25? Don Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 7, 2018 Author Share Posted September 7, 2018 (edited) It's been a struggle the entire way Don, that's for sure. Lots of filling and sanding every single seam. Here's a couple of shots showing how much Bondo and scrap plastic I used fixing up the seams after I shot my first primer coat: I was worried about the strength of the wing to fuselage joint so I epoxied a couple of brass rods into the joint to firm it up. Now I can handle it by the wing tips without fear. The clear windows in the fuselage as provided in the kit are another big hurdle. They don't fit and they aren't very clear per usual Mach 2 "clear" plastic. So I took a page from the late Bondo Phil playbook. I covered the outside of the windows with clear packing tape and poured clear casting resin inside the make the windows. Problem solved! Before I poured the resin, I had to thin the plastic around the window openings to make it more to scale with my dremel tool and sandpaper and files: As you can see from this photo, the entire kit has strange bumps/lumps of excess plastic and what looks like stress cracks. Some panel lines aren't very straight or uniform either. I tried to fix as many of these as I could. Another big disappointment of this kit is the smaller details, namely the props, engines and landing gear. They are very soft on detail so I tossed them. I replaced the props with some Aeroclub units and I have a solution in the works for the landing gear. Also, the "engines" as provided in the kit are pretty bad as well. I know now much will be seen but come on... I should post of photo of them here so you can see what I mean. Ironically, I replaced them with a set of engines from a scrapped Mach 2 C-123 kit! This kit is a tough build but since it's the only injected kit in town, it is what it is take it or leave it. I'd sure love to build a radome equipped T-29 sometime but I'm sure I could build another one of these! Oh, that B-25 you mentioned is a 1/72 TB-25N conversion I did a few years ago. Inspired by a Wolfpak decal sheet to do something different, I modified an old Italeri B-25J kit. It was a lot of fun to do I must say. I posted some photos and talked a bit about the conversion here on this thread Don: http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?/topic/286500-tb-25k-references/&tab=comments#comment-2912891 I want to do an ANG TB-25K radar nose trainer so day as well. It's just those post-war exhaust mods were very tough to do. Now if someone did a resin set of them, I'd be all over it! -Derek Edited September 15, 2018 by viking73 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Drifterdon Posted September 10, 2018 Share Posted September 10, 2018 My hat is off to you Derek! You've certainly done some master modeling on this kit to get it where it stands. I have the Mach 2 C-123 and it will never be built it's just that crappy of a kit. Can't wait to see your 131 when it's completed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 13, 2018 Author Share Posted September 13, 2018 (edited) Hi, Time for another update on the Convair. Did I mention I hate spraying white paint? I was happy with the Tamiya Pure White. It went on nicely and looked great. I only waited 24 hours for it to dry before I masked off the white and shot some Model Master ADC Gray on the rest of the airframe. Well, I think the tip of my airbrush must have been bent or damaged somehow. My gray paint came out rough and I was not happy with the way it looked at all. And then when I pulled off the blue painters tape, it did something to the white paint. It was almost like a sticky residue of some sort was left. But it seemed to be in the paint and I couldn't get in off no matter what I tried! That's what I get for using off-brand blue tape I suppose instead of the real-deal 3M stuff. Ugh... When it all dried, I wet-sanded the entire model down with worn 600 and 1000 grit sandpaper to smooth everything out again. I re-sprayed the white and after letting it dry longer than 24 hours, I masked it off and re-shot the ADC Gray. It came out nice and smooth this time around after a replacement airbrush needle was used . I removed the masking from the white paint (this time I only used Tamiya tape and Frog Tape). It looked wonderful, no problems this time! But then I noticed that somehow I had a pretty large area of gray over spray near the cockpit windows. Must have been a gap in my Frog Tape, darn it. So guess what? Here's where I screwed up the white paint yet again! Instead of a Q-tip damp with mineral spirits to carefully remove the over spray, I didn't realize I had soaked it in lacquer thinner instead (the cans look almost the same!). This of course ate right through the white paint down to the primer - NO!!! After several choice curse words I set my Convair aside. More sanding and another touch-up soon. Did I mention I hate white paint?! Some good news though- I finished the props. These are a set of OOP Aeroclub units: I also found a solution to replace the poorly molded kit landing gear. More on that soon. Thanks for looking. I hope to have a happier update next time. -Derek Edited September 13, 2018 by viking73 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 13, 2018 Author Share Posted September 13, 2018 Well that's strange. I wasn't able to add the photo to my last post. Let's see if this works. Here is the photo of the props: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 13, 2018 Author Share Posted September 13, 2018 And finally for today, here is a low-res image of the plane I'm doing. She was 53-7811 from the 147th TFW/111th FIS circa 1980. -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Drifterdon Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 Nice! Keep up the fight Derek. You're getting there! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slartibartfast Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 (edited) Dang it! Another 111th I have to build. I don't remember seeing that fly overhead. Are you using Caracal for the markings? I wonder how well the F-101B fin flash will work? Maybe an F-4 set will work better. Edited September 16, 2018 by Slartibartfast Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 16, 2018 Author Share Posted September 16, 2018 11 hours ago, Slartibartfast said: Dang it! Another 111th I have to build. I don't remember seeing that fly overhead. Are you using Caracal for the markings? I wonder how well the F-101B fin flash will work? Maybe an F-4 set will work better. Hi Slartibartfast - Yes you are 100% correct. The Texans/111th specific decals are coming from two different Caracal sheets. The large fin flash is from the 1/48 scale sheet 48035: Air National Guard F-4C/D Phantom. I tried several different scales and aircraft types when looking looking for the best one and this seems to fit the bill best. While it's not 100% matching to the photo I posted it's the best I have to work with in terms of size. For the "Texans" logo on the top of the fuselage sides, I will be using the wing tip tank decals from the 1/32 scale sheet 32009: Air National Guard T-33A. As for the other common markings, I'll be using decals from Caracal, Wolfpak, and even some old Microscal sheets I have in the decal stash. Although I hate too, I'll probably use the prop warning stripes and yellow "cut here" window decals from Caracal sheet 72027: C-123B Provider. This will be my second 111th FIS bird. I built the 1/32 Czech Model T-33 a couple years ago as a 111th bird. Here are some photos in case you missed it: http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?/topic/294873-132-czech-model-t-33a/&tab=comments#comment-2823637 I'd love to see some of your 111th builds! How many do you have? Getting back to the C-131 build, I think I am finally happy with the paint job after having all of that trouble. Here is a photo from after yesterday's (hopefully) last paint session. I've even started to add some panel line wash. Getting ahead of myself there I know. I think it's just that I might finally be seeing the light at the end of this long tunnel and that's got me excited! More coming soon! -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 Happy Monday, Just another small update on my Convair build. Using the photocopier at work, I copied all the decals for final placement and size check. The "U.S. AIR FORCE" on the nose is a bit big, so I'll need to find something smaller. Other that that, I think I'm all set. Decals are my favorite part of the build so here goes! -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 17, 2018 Author Share Posted September 17, 2018 Here's a photo. I couldn't resist adding the prop for the photo! -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 21, 2018 Author Share Posted September 21, 2018 (edited) Good Morning - I started adding a few decals last night. Cheat lines were added first. I hope to have all the decals finished up this weekend. Thanks for looking, another decal update soon! -Derek Edited September 21, 2018 by viking73 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AD-4N Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 My goodness, you have done fine work there. But couldn't we get a C-131 (1/144 or 1/72) from a real model company. I built the Mach 2 PBM so we could all get the MInicraft version. Thanks for blazing the way, oh pioneer. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
iaf-man Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 There's the Welsh vac-resin though,not a "real one" :-) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 21, 2018 Author Share Posted September 21, 2018 (edited) Thanks gents. Yes, if I have to "sacrifice" myself on this Mach 2 build to get a good injected Convair twin, so be it! Happy to do it. I know Minicraft planned to do one in 1/144 some years ago but it was apparently shelved for good which I was really sorry to hear about. However, it seems that Roden is going to take up that 1/144 torch if this is to be believed (I'm still waiting on their 1/144 C-133 myself!): https://www.hannants.co.uk/product/ROD334 Funny you should mention the Welsh vac kit iak-man. I e-mailed them to see if I could purchase a set of metal gear for my build. The Mach 2 gear and wheels leave a lot to be desired as you can imagine - soft details and the mold halves seemed to be misaligned. Not got. I didn't want to go to all this trouble to stick poor looking gear on my Convair. I was happy when they replied that yes, they would sell me the white metal gear but I would have to buy the entire set of white metal parts. An "all or nothing" type deal. It was a bit of an expensive fix but since I don't think I could have scratch built the gear, I paid my $$$ to them. About 10 days later a package from Welsh Models arrived in my mailbox. Let me tell you, I was very impressed with the quality of the metal parts. It was a very comprehensive set - props gear, landing gear doors and all sorts of antennas. The props will be used to replaced the incorrectly sized ones in my Hasegawa S-2 Tracker but that's another story. Here's a shot of the gear, all ready to be installed. I need to put a landing light on the nose gear but that will be one of the last items to add. I'll be sure to add another update soon on the decals. They are looking good if I don't say so myself! -Derek Edited September 21, 2018 by viking73 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
iaf-man Posted September 22, 2018 Share Posted September 22, 2018 Derek indeed beautifull set!!! Densil of Welsh is a good guy to deal with Quote Link to post Share on other sites
viking73 Posted September 23, 2018 Author Share Posted September 23, 2018 17 hours ago, iaf-man said: Derek indeed beautifull set!!! Densil of Welsh is a good guy to deal with Yes that is a fact. Densil was great to deal with for sure. She's really coming together! Thanks for looking! -Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dutch Posted September 24, 2018 Share Posted September 24, 2018 Beautiful work Derek, keep a goin'! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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