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smokeriderdon

H-21 build

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I am doing a build of the H-21 (1/72 Italeri kit) in USAF markings. I have ordered the decals and have some questions I am posting to several boards for feedback.

 

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For the exterior, the decals call out aluminum and florescent red orange. The color I used on my H-34. Which is fine, BUT...the only color pics with the same markings but different tail number that I can find is the single one I have in the album. And that CLEARLY is a funky red. And other USAF H-21s from different squadrons also have that same funky red. And even the pic of the real copter with the decal set looks more red than orange to me.

 

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So what do you all think? And does the aluminum look more painted than BM? Im thinking painted.

Next. Is that a fuel tank slung under it in the B&W pic????? One person elsewhere said it was and the thought is a wing tip tank from an F-94 would work. Thoughts?

 

i-qhPBZVd-S.jpg

Edited by smokeriderdon

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My father said that the florescent red orange really faded into some weird shades after it was applied. 

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Hi 

I'm building an old Aurora 1/48 H-21 and recently asked the same questions on the Props forum in my thread entitled "USAF ARS Band and arctic colors".

Please take a look. Helpful members posted the H-21 page with color reference numbers.

 

Also, here is a link to another ARC thread that discusses the color with paint samples:

 

In short, I found the same info you did: some period photos , the am decal guides and two surviving aircraft on static display in Alaska show red. 

But the official USAF painting guide TO 1-1-4, clearly states it to be International Orange.

I'm going with orange because of the fading issue previously mentioned and the fact the current display aircraft may have been refinished with available colors, not necessarily CORRECT colors (either because of supply constraints or to prevent fading and the static aircraft looking shabby).

 

Also, don't assume the fluorescent red/orange seen in USAF aircraft of the late 50s to early 60s for conspicuous anti-collision markings is the same color as the arctic high-vis colors. I believe they are different.

Edited by JohnEB
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Thank you sir! Dutch always comes up with interesting stuff. 🙂

 

I used 28915 on my H-34. It seemed too orange to me for this build. I have 28913 on hand as well, and as the one I am doing is from 1960, it could be either one. I was looking at different reds at the hobby store, and stop light red seemed fairly close to what I see in the pics. This one is gonna be a last minute decision I think. LOL

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Have you done a search in the helo forum, I think both was discussed years ago? The tanks is a F-80 tank, not sure if that is the same as a F-84 wing tip tank. 

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47 minutes ago, midnightprowler said:

Would you be interested in parting with the OD Army set?

 

Once I am done, I will let you know. I have no plans to do an Army version, so they will just sit around.

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25 minutes ago, Winnie said:

The tanks could be carried two side by side.

And the Italeri kit I built some time ago, had two included...

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4 hours ago, GeejeeZ said:

And the Italeri kit I built some time ago, had two included...

 

This one doesnt unfortunately.  From what I understand they were in the 1/48 kits.

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I had a look at a Monograph I have on the H-21. It says "Aluminium and Red" for that particular scheme. Looking at the B&W photos, the colours have the correct depth to be red as opposed to orange or fluro-orange. 

 

LD.

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For what it's worth, today I stumbled across a photo of an H-21 with the twin fuel tanks...its aft fuselage color was very red-orange, very much like the International Orange seen above.

 

I'm not sure there is a "right" answer to this issue given:

-The TO says Orange

-Old photos show red (as do two survivors)

-Another old photo shows Red-Orange

- And the color's propensity to fade.

 

 

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1 hour ago, JohnEB said:

For what it's worth, today I stumbled across a photo of an H-21 with the twin fuel tanks...its aft fuselage color was very red-orange, very much like the International Orange seen above.

 

I'm not sure there is a "right" answer to this issue given:

-The TO says Orange

-Old photos show red (as do two survivors)

-Another old photo shows Red-Orange

- And the color's propensity to fade.

 

 

Yeah, as with many color questions of stuff from 50 or more years ago, it's really a toss up. It seems any one of four different colors will work. Not counting in fading variations. I will ponder this until it's time to spray.

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H-21okino.jpg.0ef82146c0c65b8a300f4d801e9fdb85.jpg

 

FWIW, it looks red to me. LD, I too have a Piasecki H-21 book and did not even think to look there. I do have a couple of color photos of H-21s of the Japan based squadron with the green and white checks, and the tail looks red to me. I have not done a scientific study of the color yet, but a look in my Schiffer book of 1950's USAF aircraft shows lots of different types of aircraft, from fighters to transports to B-36 bombers with red [definitely red] arctic conspicuity markings on wings and tails. FS12197 would not have faded darker,  but lighter,  so go with a deeper red. My $.02! K/r, Dutch 

Edited by Dutch

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On ‎12‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 10:23 PM, smokeriderdon said:

 

This one doesnt unfortunately.  From what I understand they were in the 1/48 kits.

Not that it's of help to you now, but no: it was in a 1/72 kit.

Edited by GeejeeZ

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OK, so let just say I will NOT be buying Print Scale decals again. These things are atrocious. They do not adhere. It requires multiple multiple applications of Micro Sol and or Solva set to get them to maybe stay down. We will see.

I was cutting the window portions of the right side checker decal. Got the second window done. I blew on it to get little bits off. Mind you, I had micro soled it TWICE yesterday and left it to sit for 24 hours. When I blew on it, half of it blew up off the model ad twisted into a unrescuable mess. The walkway on top also blew off, but managed not to twist up. That required another 2 applications of micro sol AND one of solva set to finally stay down. The checker strip was toast. Sooooo...

Command decision time. Just leave it without the checkerboard down the fuselage, or order yet another set and still have the same issues. I thought maybe I could make a template to pre cut the windows, but then these flimsy fool things would just fold onto themselves even worse than before. So I decided that it would just have to be without that feature. The decals were inaccurate anyway. And it looks good as is. I did not even try to use the stencils.

I did venture into the spares bin to find some fuel tanks or something close. I did find a couple tank looking things. Could be bombs, not sure. The sprue didnt have the ID tab so not sure what they came from. But they look close. So I will fiddle with those and see if I can figure how to hang them. But for now, I am gonna call her done.

 

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its looking real good from here. May i suggest adding some kind of ground equipment to go along this great build. Too bad about the decals but it does work without them too.

Oliver

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17 hours ago, midnightprowler said:

Beautiful in spite of issues.

 

Thank you!

 

13 hours ago, Rotorman said:

its looking real good from here. May i suggest adding some kind of ground equipment to go along this great build. Too bad about the decals but it does work without them too.

Oliver

Thank you sir. The base was just for the pics. This one now resides in my 1/72 and smaller cabinet. Ground equipment would be cool if it were staying with that base.

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