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2 hours ago, 11bee said:

But hey, at least in America, we’ve got the right to party.  


that’s right! cause ‘Merica! 🙄

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SBARC said:

First let me say....saving peoples lives is the most important thing regarding this virus and the economy if very much a secondary detail.

 

Everyone staying home will destroy the economy.  Many people will get this and get over it after a few weeks.  In theory those people would be immune to the virus and able to go back to work and keep the economy going.  But without mass testing, you will not know who had the virus and is now immune.  Everyone staying home for 1 year will be devastating to the economy.  Also critical staff should be tested, if they had the virus and recovered with mild symptoms (felt like a cold) then they could relax knowing they are immune to being re-infected.

 

The lack of massive testing will cost many many lives and cause more damage to the economy.

 

Germany has done massive amounts of testing and their death rate is VERY low.

 

This is complicated.  First, it is not clear to what extent you're immune once you've had the illness.  Tests are remaining positive in people who appear to have recovered (i..e., the virus is still living in them).  But what that means is unclear.  Some speculate it means you get no immunity by having the disease and can easily get it again.  That's likely not true to that extreme, but we don't know.

 

Secondly, case fatality ratio always has a more accurate numerator (deaths) because those are obvious.  The denominator is hard to know, because of lot of these people may just think they have the flu.  So Germany's true case fatality ratio may appear much better than the USA because they simply know more about the real denominator.  Just because we don't know about a case of coronavirus in the USA doesn't mean it doesn't exist and play in to the denominator.

 

Where extensive and rapid (this 2 day wait for results with the CDC test is BS when others can come back in 4 hours) testing do save lives is in early isolation of infected individuals preventing further infection.  But that won't reflect in the case fatality ratio. 

Edited by ESzczesniak

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Curt B said:

How many of you have been directly affected by this virus?  

Both my wife and I have been to the ER three times in three days. Last night I was trans'd by ambulance because my breathing was on the fritz. My vitals and all my tests showed that I was low risk and this won't kill me at 39 years of age. I've never had shortness of breath like that. I believe God delivered me. This is a nasty, nasty bug. They won't run a CO-19 test on me or the wife either. No point, it would be throwing money away according to the ER Doc. I want a test for my own curiosity and own records for my wife and I, but with so few test kits out in the wild, save it for others until we have enough. I'm blessed to be going through this first for my faith as it is being refined and teaching me about my dependency on God, but also because in the coming weeks I fear the tidal wave is coming. I'm blessed to do it now, before resources may be overwhelmed. 

 

Symptoms showed up over the weekend. Mild cold, fatigue, aches, slight headaches, nausea. Dry cough bout early Sunday morning. Felt better on Monday and went for a 5.75 mile run without issue. Tuesday,  shortness of breath. Simultaneously my wife was having worse symptoms and trying to get ahold of an advice nurse (I'm military). I called too because of shortness of breath and whatever the nurse on the other line heard from me, she told me to call 911. Went in an got an xray and flu swab told bronchitis and left with a prescription for a zpac. The next day felt a bit better and the wife couldn't breathe. Felt like her air passage way was closing up. Drove to the ER and same diagnosis except they test her for strep, gave her prescription for a zpack. I'm still short of breath but okay. Come yesterday, very short on breath and finally at night it hit hard. I never lost consciousness, but I felt like it was about to slip. Took an ambulance ride to the ER and was given steroids which let me breathe again (lovely feeling by the way) with deep breaths. Released at 0345 this morning and here I am now with some new meds and doing better. Talking and walking take it out of me so I'm in the basement relaxing. The cooler air helps too. The wife is doing better. So we're going fight it isolated with the kids and my parents over the next couple weeks. My quick story. 

Edited by fulcrum1

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Fulcrum1, hope both you and your wife will all right. I understand (kinda) them not testing for Covid-19 due to shortage of kits, but it is still wrong and they won't have a handle on what is really going on until they can test everyone with symptoms, especially ones as severe as you and your wife's.

In the meantime, take care of yourselves.

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6 hours ago, 11bee said:

Disgusting.   We are bringing this on ourselves by allowing this BS behavior.    China just arrested an Australian women and is deporting her because she went for a jog (without face mask as well).   Her company (Biogen) just announced they had fired her after pressure from the Chinese government.  
 

That’s a good illustration of why China appears to now have this under control and here in the US, folks are now talking about being under lockdown for over a year with a death toll far surpassing China’s.  
 

But hey, at least in America, we’ve got the right to party.  

 

One of the reasons that China has been able to get on top of this is because they can force isolate people without them screaming about rights violations. People with fever or other symptoms are taken to isolation centers. If they test for Covid-19 they are moved to completely different isolation centers. I doubt very much that Americans would tolerate forced internment of potential cases. Nor even actual cases. I don't know how bad this will get here, but worse case is worse than Italy as hospitals collapse and supply lines falter. I am scared.

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15 hours ago, Whiskey said:

"Apparently stupidity is contagious, too."

 

Pray for high tide.......

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55 minutes ago, Mstor said:

 

One of the reasons that China has been able to get on top of this is because they can force isolate people without them screaming about rights violations. People with fever or other symptoms are taken to isolation centers. If they test for Covid-19 they are moved to completely different isolation centers. I doubt very much that Americans would tolerate forced internment of potential cases.

 

There have been (secretly recorded) cellphone video clips of how the Chinese authorities enforced isolation of suspected cases.  Multiple human rights violations.  People were dragged like animals and stuffed into isolation cages.  One man was beaten, kicked and carried by the arms and legs from his home to an isolation center.  This was done in front of his family. 

 

At their regional airports, people were dragged, screaming & shrieking, and stuffed into make-shift isolation containers which appeared to be airliner cargo containers & airline food carts with a plexiglass goldfish bowl window welded onto the side.  These people, still screaming and banging on the inside of the cargo container walls, are then forklifted onto trucks and driven off somewhere.

 

There is a clip of 7 -8 young police officers brutally dragging a young woman ( maybe in her 20s) down to the street, all 7-8 of them kicking her repeatedly while she was on the ground, then grabbing her by the head and stuffing her into a police van.

 

China has been successful because of brute force and treating people like animals rather than human beings.  This will NEVER work outside of China.

 

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1 hour ago, JackMan said:

China has been successful because of brute force and treating people like animals rather than human beings.  This will NEVER work outside of China.

 

Exactly. I didn't know they have been so brutal about it, but knowing China's human rights history I'm not surprised. My point was that even a benign form of this type of isolation wouldn't be tolerated here in the USA. I just hope that enough people will self isolate to contain this in most areas.

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3 hours ago, fulcrum1 said:

Both my wife and I have been to the ER three times in three days. Last night I was trans'd by ambulance because my breathing was on the fritz. My vitals and all my tests showed that I was low risk and this won't kill me at 39 years of age. I've never had shortness of breath like that. I believe God delivered me. This is a nasty, nasty bug. They won't run a CO-19 test on me or the wife either. No point, it would be throwing money away according to the ER Doc. I want a test for my own curiosity and own records for my wife and I, but with so few test kits out in the wild, save it for others until we have enough. I'm blessed to be going through this first for my faith as it is being refined and teaching me about my dependency on God, but also because in the coming weeks I fear the tidal wave is coming. I'm blessed to do it now, before resources may be overwhelmed. 

 

Symptoms showed up over the weekend. Mild cold, fatigue, aches, slight headaches, nausea. Dry cough bout early Sunday morning. Felt better on Monday and went for a 5.75 mile run without issue. Tuesday,  shortness of breath. Simultaneously my wife was having worse symptoms and trying to get ahold of an advice nurse (I'm military). I called too because of shortness of breath and whatever the nurse on the other line heard from me, she told me to call 911. Went in an got an xray and flu swab told bronchitis and left with a prescription for a zpac. The next day felt a bit better and the wife couldn't breathe. Felt like her air passage way was closing up. Drove to the ER and same diagnosis except they test her for strep, gave her prescription for a zpack. I'm still short of breath but okay. Come yesterday, very short on breath and finally at night it hit hard. I never lost consciousness, but I felt like it was about to slip. Took an ambulance ride to the ER and was given steroids which let me breathe again (lovely feeling by the way) with deep breaths. Released at 0345 this morning and here I am now with some new meds and doing better. Talking and walking take it out of me so I'm in the basement relaxing. The cooler air helps too. The wife is doing better. So we're going fight it isolated with the kids and my parents over the next couple weeks. My quick story. 

 

Awful experience...sorry for your having to go through it, but glad you've survived it.  Best of luck to you and your wife!

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3 hours ago, fulcrum1 said:

Both my wife and I have been to the ER three times in three days. Last night I was trans'd by ambulance because my breathing was on the fritz. My vitals and all my tests showed that I was low risk and this won't kill me at 39 years of age. I've never had shortness of breath like that. I believe God delivered me. This is a nasty, nasty bug. They won't run a CO-19 test on me or the wife either. No point, it would be throwing money away according to the ER Doc. I want a test for my own curiosity and own records for my wife and I, but with so few test kits out in the wild, save it for others until we have enough. I'm blessed to be going through this first for my faith as it is being refined and teaching me about my dependency on God, but also because in the coming weeks I fear the tidal wave is coming. I'm blessed to do it now, before resources may be overwhelmed. 

 

3 hours ago, Mstor said:

Fulcrum1, hope both you and your wife will all right. I understand (kinda) them not testing for Covid-19 due to shortage of kits, but it is still wrong and they won't have a handle on what is really going on until they can test everyone with symptoms, especially ones as severe as you and your wife's.

In the meantime, take care of yourselves.

 

Oh my! Glad y'all are recovering. What a way to have faith refined. That shortage of test kits is disappointing, and I wonder if there are cases were people won't be able to get some coverage or compensation because they were not tested.

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3 hours ago, fulcrum1 said:

Both my wife and I have been to the ER three times in three days. Last night I was trans'd by ambulance because my breathing was on the fritz. My vitals and all my tests showed that I was low risk and this won't kill me at 39 years of age. I've never had shortness of breath like that. I believe God delivered me. This is a nasty, nasty bug. They won't run a CO-19 test on me or the wife either. No point, it would be throwing money away according to the ER Doc. I want a test for my own curiosity and own records for my wife and I, but with so few test kits out in the wild, save it for others until we have enough. I'm blessed to be going through this first for my faith as it is being refined and teaching me about my dependency on God, but also because in the coming weeks I fear the tidal wave is coming. I'm blessed to do it now, before resources may be overwhelmed. 

 

Symptoms showed up over the weekend. Mild cold, fatigue, aches, slight headaches, nausea. Dry cough bout early Sunday morning. Felt better on Monday and went for a 5.75 mile run without issue. Tuesday,  shortness of breath. Simultaneously my wife was having worse symptoms and trying to get ahold of an advice nurse (I'm military). I called too because of shortness of breath and whatever the nurse on the other line heard from me, she told me to call 911. Went in an got an xray and flu swab told bronchitis and left with a prescription for a zpac. The next day felt a bit better and the wife couldn't breathe. Felt like her air passage way was closing up. Drove to the ER and same diagnosis except they test her for strep, gave her prescription for a zpack. I'm still short of breath but okay. Come yesterday, very short on breath and finally at night it hit hard. I never lost consciousness, but I felt like it was about to slip. Took an ambulance ride to the ER and was given steroids which let me breathe again (lovely feeling by the way) with deep breaths. Released at 0345 this morning and here I am now with some new meds and doing better. Talking and walking take it out of me so I'm in the basement relaxing. The cooler air helps too. The wife is doing better. So we're going fight it isolated with the kids and my parents over the next couple weeks. My quick story. 

 

Good luck to you and your wife...I am not a doctor. but from what I have read, I would say you have the Covid-19 virus.

 

I'm just waiting to get the virus myself and hoping it is a mild case of it.

 

If there are 350,000,000 in the USA and if 70% get infected and if 2% die.....that comes out to over 5 million people will die. 

Numbers like that are impossible to wrap my mind around.

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, 11bee said:

Disgusting.   We are bringing this on ourselves by allowing this BS behavior.    China just arrested an Australian women and is deporting her because she went for a jog (without face mask as well).   Her company (Biogen) just announced they had fired her after pressure from the Chinese government.  
 

That’s a good illustration of why China appears to now have this under control and here in the US, folks are now talking about being under lockdown for over a year with a death toll far surpassing China’s.  
 

But hey, at least in America, we’ve got the right to party.  

 

Though let's remember it appears this virus in humans originated in China, due to endangered animals being kept in markets, then being eaten by humans = viral mutation.  Hopefully they might now learn to clean up their act.

 

Here in Oz, we've had people from cities hiring buses to travel out to country areas, and cleaning out small supermarkets - and guess the ethnic origin of most of these people?

 

 

 

 

Edited by Thommo

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6 minutes ago, Thommo said:

 

Though let's remember it appears this virus in humans originated in China, due to endangered animals being kept in markets, then being eaten by humans = viral mutation.  Hopefully they might now learn to clean up their act.

 

Here in Oz, we've had people from cities hiring buses to travel out to country areas, and cleaning out small supermarkets - and guess the ethnic origin of most of these people?

 

 

 

 

 

This is because they know the nightmare that is coming.

 

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11 minutes ago, SBARC said:

 

This is because they know the nightmare that is coming.

 

 

It's not the Australia I grew up in.  It disgusts me. Australians have a strong track record of looking after each other in times of crisis. They don't act like total selfish a-holes.

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10 hours ago, fulcrum1 said:

Both my wife and I have been to the ER three times in three days. Last night I was trans'd by ambulance because my breathing was on the fritz. My vitals and all my tests showed that I was low risk and this won't kill me at 39 years of age. I've never had shortness of breath like that. I believe God delivered me. This is a nasty, nasty bug. They won't run a CO-19 test on me or the wife either. No point, it would be throwing money away according to the ER Doc. I want a test for my own curiosity and own records for my wife and I, but with so few test kits out in the wild, save it for others until we have enough. I'm blessed to be going through this first for my faith as it is being refined and teaching me about my dependency on God, but also because in the coming weeks I fear the tidal wave is coming. I'm blessed to do it now, before resources may be overwhelmed. 

 

Symptoms showed up over the weekend. Mild cold, fatigue, aches, slight headaches, nausea. Dry cough bout early Sunday morning. Felt better on Monday and went for a 5.75 mile run without issue. Tuesday,  shortness of breath. Simultaneously my wife was having worse symptoms and trying to get ahold of an advice nurse (I'm military). I called too because of shortness of breath and whatever the nurse on the other line heard from me, she told me to call 911. Went in an got an xray and flu swab told bronchitis and left with a prescription for a zpac. The next day felt a bit better and the wife couldn't breathe. Felt like her air passage way was closing up. Drove to the ER and same diagnosis except they test her for strep, gave her prescription for a zpack. I'm still short of breath but okay. Come yesterday, very short on breath and finally at night it hit hard. I never lost consciousness, but I felt like it was about to slip. Took an ambulance ride to the ER and was given steroids which let me breathe again (lovely feeling by the way) with deep breaths. Released at 0345 this morning and here I am now with some new meds and doing better. Talking and walking take it out of me so I'm in the basement relaxing. The cooler air helps too. The wife is doing better. So we're going fight it isolated with the kids and my parents over the next couple weeks. My quick story. 

That’s scary stuff, glad you and the wife are feeling better.   I just wonder how things would have progressed if you got this a few weeks / months from now when our medical system is supposed to be as overwhelmed as Italy’s currently is.  As it is now, many hospitals and first responders are already running out of PPE. 
 

Scary stuff

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9 hours ago, JackMan said:

 

There have been (secretly recorded) cellphone video clips of how the Chinese authorities enforced isolation of suspected cases.  Multiple human rights violations.  People were dragged like animals and stuffed into isolation cages.  One man was beaten, kicked and carried by the arms and legs from his home to an isolation center.  This was done in front of his family. 

 

At their regional airports, people were dragged, screaming & shrieking, and stuffed into make-shift isolation containers which appeared to be airliner cargo containers & airline food carts with a plexiglass goldfish bowl window welded onto the side.  These people, still screaming and banging on the inside of the cargo container walls, are then forklifted onto trucks and driven off somewhere.

 

There is a clip of 7 -8 young police officers brutally dragging a young woman ( maybe in her 20s) down to the street, all 7-8 of them kicking her repeatedly while she was on the ground, then grabbing her by the head and stuffing her into a police van.

 

China has been successful because of brute force and treating people like animals rather than human beings.  This will NEVER work outside of China.

 

 

And yet again, China reports no new cases and is moving forward with the process of getting people back to work, opening businesses, airports, etc.  Compare to the forecast here in the US of being confined to home for possibly as long as 12-18 months, pretty much complete economic ruin, the worst unemployment since the great depression, pretty much every small business gone away, etc and collapse of our medical system.   But hey, while we sitting home watching all this for the next year or so, we can take solace that we never had to give up our rights.

 

BTW, please post links to all those videos.....

 

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36 minutes ago, 11bee said:

 

BTW, please post links to all those videos.....

 

 

I have no links because they were sent via Whatsapp.  Not sure who was the original sender because when you are part of a few Whatsapp groups, you get forwarded a lot of stuff from other people who themselves received videos that were forwarded from others. However, I do recall seeing that clip of the 7-8 police officers beating up the young woman on one of the TV news channels. Can't recall which one ( BBC maybe?)

 

Quote

And yet again, China reports no new cases and is moving forward with the process of getting people back to work, opening businesses, airports, etc.  Compare to the forecast here in the US of being confined to home for possibly as long as 12-18 months, pretty much complete economic ruin, the worst unemployment since the great depression, pretty much every small business gone away, etc and collapse of our medical system.

 

Firstly, you have to take what comes of the CCP propaganda machine with a pinch of salt, especially if they say there are "no new cases".

 

Secondly,  much of what is happening in the US and most of the world is a direct result of the CCP not being honest with what was happening in Wuhan.  They kept it hidden for weeks before it got so out of hand that they couldn't hide it anymore. They even arrested a young doctor ( who has since died of the Wuhan virus) because he dared to tell the truth about this new virus and revealed in cellphone videos about what was happening over there.  The mayor of Wuhan has admitted that around 5 million people had already left the city before the lockdown order was given.  You can imagine with the Chinese New Year traveling rush, with packed public transports, and the rush back after the New Year,  how many of those folks had already come into contact with others and had spread the virus.

 

I just pray some scientists will quickly find a cure. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Whiskey said:

And yet they are turning the corner with much less economic damage and deaths than what is predicted here.  What’s the lesser of two evils?   Personally, I’d rather opt for China’s method.  All our wonderful rights and liberties aren’t going to help much if things get as bad as expected.  
 

Maybe if we ask them nicely, China will send us PPE, medicine, ventilators and TP since we aren’t even really even close to the worst of this and already are running short.  

Edited by 11bee

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1 hour ago, 11bee said:

And yet they are turning the corner with much less economic damage and deaths than what is predicted here.  

 

How do you know this?  Did you "read it on the internet" ?  Do you trust the news being released by the Chinese government?

 

I don't.

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I personally don't trust one single word coming out of communist China. But that's just me.

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Yesterday, we were at Walmart doing our weekly grocery shopping - and they finally had

some Toilet Paper and Paper Towels. Not much, but we were able to buy our (one pack

limit per customer) and we were so thrilled. "Never in my life have I been so excited with

being able to purchase some TP - the things we take for granted!"

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18 hours ago, fulcrum1 said:

Both my wife and I have been to the ER three times in three days. Last night I was trans'd by ambulance because my breathing was on the fritz. My vitals and all my tests showed that I was low risk and this won't kill me at 39 years of age. I've never had shortness of breath like that. I believe God delivered me. This is a nasty, nasty bug. They won't run a CO-19 test on me or the wife either. No point, it would be throwing money away according to the ER Doc. I want a test for my own curiosity and own records for my wife and I, but with so few test kits out in the wild, save it for others until we have enough. I'm blessed to be going through this first for my faith as it is being refined and teaching me about my dependency on God, but also because in the coming weeks I fear the tidal wave is coming. I'm blessed to do it now, before resources may be overwhelmed. 

 

Symptoms showed up over the weekend. Mild cold, fatigue, aches, slight headaches, nausea. Dry cough bout early Sunday morning. Felt better on Monday and went for a 5.75 mile run without issue. Tuesday,  shortness of breath. Simultaneously my wife was having worse symptoms and trying to get ahold of an advice nurse (I'm military). I called too because of shortness of breath and whatever the nurse on the other line heard from me, she told me to call 911. Went in an got an xray and flu swab told bronchitis and left with a prescription for a zpac. The next day felt a bit better and the wife couldn't breathe. Felt like her air passage way was closing up. Drove to the ER and same diagnosis except they test her for strep, gave her prescription for a zpack. I'm still short of breath but okay. Come yesterday, very short on breath and finally at night it hit hard. I never lost consciousness, but I felt like it was about to slip. Took an ambulance ride to the ER and was given steroids which let me breathe again (lovely feeling by the way) with deep breaths. Released at 0345 this morning and here I am now with some new meds and doing better. Talking and walking take it out of me so I'm in the basement relaxing. The cooler air helps too. The wife is doing better. So we're going fight it isolated with the kids and my parents over the next couple weeks. My quick story. 

 

Fulcrum1,

Glad to hear you and your wife are recovering and feeling better. Really puts things into

the proper perspectives. Hopefully, the worse is behind you and continue to improve so

you and your family can get back to enjoying life!

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1 hour ago, The Underdog said:

 

Fulcrum1,

Glad to hear you and your wife are recovering and feeling better. Really puts things into

the proper perspectives. Hopefully, the worse is behind you and continue to improve so

you and your family can get back to enjoying life!

Thanks! Last week I had made plans to hack at the stash and selfishly was looking forward to teleworking from home while being with my family. All about me, me, me. Now, I'll still build some models, but more importantly I'm reaching out to folk I haven't in awhile and asking how they're doing. Seeing what I can do with the abundance I have been blessed with.

 

 

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