Jump to content

Covid-19 and how to help each other...no politics


Recommended Posts

The Covid vaccines do not make you imune against cathing any of the covid variants. It makes you more resilient towards them. Big difference. 

It is a common misunderstand that the vaccines make you imune. Although some vaccines do make you imune against certain illnesses, covid-vaccines are not one of these. 

There is plenty of other vaccines that work the same way, but you have to remember that you still can catch, carry and spread infections without becoming ill yourself due to the vaccine you have taken against it. Only sad for those you come in contact with who aren't vaccinated. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Natural immunity is just as good as the shot.  I've survived COVID three times (OG, Delta,Omicron) each iteration is less of an impact.

 

My issue is the forcing of the Pfizer shot on folks when other treatments may also work.  CDC now says they are looking at Ivermectin as an acceptable treatment.

 

The shot may be safe, may not.  We are looking at the largest vaccine trial in history, meanwhile death rates (since we started mass Covid vaccinations) are doubled for some reason.

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Niels said:

The Covid vaccines do not make you imune against cathing any of the covid variants. It makes you more resilient towards them. Big difference. 

It is a common misunderstand that the vaccines make you imune. Although some vaccines do make you imune against certain illnesses, covid-vaccines are not one of these. 

There is plenty of other vaccines that work the same way, but you have to remember that you still can catch, carry and spread infections without becoming ill yourself due to the vaccine you have taken against it. Only sad for those you come in contact with who aren't vaccinated. 

I agree but go back and look at how the vaccine was promoted to the general public. First it was put out that if you get the vaccine it would prevent one from getting COVID and it would prevent the spread of COVID. When that proved to be false it was promoted that it would lessen the symptoms if one did contract the virus and lower the death rate, this was again proven to be false. Everything that was promoted turned out to be lies and now there are health issues arising from the vaccine. I got the vaccine when it first came out because I knew the gov't would make it mandatory for everyone working for the gov't (military/civilians/contractors) and it made me sicker than I have been in twenty years. If the vaccine did what the gov't said it would do there would have been no need to force anyone, it would have sold it self.

Link to post
Share on other sites

That is an experience not shared by everyone. May be differences from country to country, but the vaccines where never marketed as guarantee against getting the disise, only lessoning the impact. Most deaths where due to other underlying illnesses in addition to covid, not covid alone. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Niels said:

That is an experience not shared by everyone. May be differences from country to country, but the vaccines where never marketed as guarantee against getting the disise, only lessoning the impact. Most deaths where due to other underlying illnesses in addition to covid, not covid alone. 


And the vaccine was developed for delta and earlier variants. Which it did largely eradicate. Against omicron and on variants it was less effective at reducing although we were lucky it still lessened the impact.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Da SWO said:

Natural immunity is just as good as the shot.  I've survived COVID three times (OG, Delta,Omicron) each iteration is less of an impact.

 

My issue is the forcing of the Pfizer shot on folks when other treatments may also work.  CDC now says they are looking at Ivermectin as an acceptable treatment.

 

The shot may be safe, may not.  We are looking at the largest vaccine trial in history, meanwhile death rates (since we started mass Covid vaccinations) are doubled for some reason.

no, the CDC is NOT looking at Ivermectin as an acceptable treatment, and 'death rates' have not doubled (for any reason).

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Death rates have not doubled since vaccines were made available, but the number of deaths has - and the overwhelming majority of those deaths have been unvaccinated people. 

 

.

 

Edited by habu2
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Scooby said:


And the vaccine was developed for delta and earlier variants. Which it did largely eradicate. Against omicron and on variants it was less effective at reducing although we were lucky it still lessened the impact.

If the vaccine had largely eradicated the earlier variants there won't be any follow on variants. The virus is mutating and in order for it to mutate the previous version of the virus must be around in significantly large percentage.

 

The vaccine was developed for the original strain and no others, the other strains came after the vaccine was already developed and in use.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Vaccines don't eradicate or kill a virus, they help the human body avoid viral infection and mitigate the effects of the virus if/when infected. As you said, the virus does mutate - and it mutates more often (more variants) when a larger number of infected people continue to spread it. That large number of infected people are, primarily, the unvaccinated.

 

The original vaccine was developed for the original strain because there were no significant mutations *at that time*. You can't make a new vaccine for a mutated variant that doesn't yet exist. There are currently updated vaccines tailored to the omicron and B4.5 variants, they are FDA approved and available now. But they only work, only protect, and only slow/stop the continued spread and mutation of the virus if a large majority of the global population gets the shot. 

 

Unvaccinated people are the primary reason we are still dealing with this virus. 

 

.

 

Edited by habu2
Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, GW8345 said:

Never mind, everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

As Habu mentioned, the virus mutated due to so many people not being vaccinated,

some by choice,

others due to the developed world not sharing the vaccine with countries that needed it.

 

And yes, the virus originated in bats, it was not man made. It was likely harvested and accidentally/carelessly released from a lab, but it is not man made.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Scooby said:

As Habu mentioned, the virus mutated due to so many people not being vaccinated,

some by choice,

others due to the developed world not sharing the vaccine with countries that needed it.

 

And yes, the virus originated in bats, it was not man made. It was likely harvested and accidentally/carelessly released from a lab, but it is not man made.

As I stated, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, if you want to believe the virus originated from bats then knock yourself out.

 

Heck, you have the right to believe 9/11 was a gov't operation, that the Holocaust didn't happen, that Sandy Hook was fake and that the US never sent a man to the moon. I just take offense in someone who blames the unvax because they chose to exercise their right not to be forced to inject something into their body they don't want. Again, everyone has the right to believe what they want, what you don't have the right to do (at least here in the states) is to force your beliefs onto others.

 

And to say that it is because of the unvax that the virus is still around shows how far removed someone can be removed from reality and facts it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, GW8345 said:

Again, everyone has the right to believe what they want, what you don't have the right to do (at least here in the states) is to force your beliefs onto others.

 

And to say that it is because of the unvax that the virus is still around shows how far removed someone can be removed from reality and facts it.

 

oh the irony......

Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, GW8345 said:

As I stated, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, if you want to believe the virus originated from bats then knock yourself out.

 

Heck, you have the right to believe 9/11 was a gov't operation, that the Holocaust didn't happen, that Sandy Hook was fake and that the US never sent a man to the moon. I just take offense in someone who blames the unvax because they chose to exercise their right not to be forced to inject something into their body they don't want. Again, everyone has the right to believe what they want, what you don't have the right to do (at least here in the states) is to force your beliefs onto others.

 

And to say that it is because of the unvax that the virus is still around shows how far removed someone can be removed from reality and facts it.

 

There are two separate issues that you and other are anti-vaxers keep conflating. Also you keep deflecting the discussion by bringing up unrelated issues to create the illusion that pro-vaxers are peddling their unsubstantiated beliefs on you. This is not the case. 

 

(1) On the issue whether you have the right not to get vaccinated. Of course you do. Everyone does. 

 

(2) Regardless of whether you are exercising your right to not be vaccinated, there are facts you simply cannot ignore. These facts don't care about your political stance, if it is morally right or wrong for a government to require vaccination, or if you believe covid was man-made or not. The fact is vaccination provides protection against spread, hospitalization, and death. And by a lot! Death rates among the unvaccinated are significantly larger than those who have been vaccinated. These facts cannot be disputed.

 

I don't understand how anybody can make generalizations about their personal experiences to pass judgment about the validity of the facts around a global crisis. Again, you have the right not to be vaccinated, but that does not imply that unvaccinated are just as healthy as the vaccinated or other BS people keep peddling. 

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-to-compare-covid-deaths-for-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-people/

 

https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths-by-vaccination

 

https://doh.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2022-02/421-010-CasesInNotFullyVaccinated.pdf. (Yes, data is from WA only, so please argue that this does not apply to the rest of U.S.).

 

So what are you precisely saying? 

 

To all others, if you are unvaccinated thinking this is a global hoax, and that you and your five friends are living fine unvaxxed, you just have to thank the billions who did the right thing and got vaxxed to slow down and control this virus. You're getting a free and fast ride away from death, and you think the car is stationary and the death is simply moving away from you. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, GW8345 said:

As I stated, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, if you want to believe the virus originated from bats then knock yourself out.

 

Heck, you have the right to believe 9/11 was a gov't operation, that the Holocaust didn't happen, that Sandy Hook was fake and that the US never sent a man to the moon. I just take offense in someone who blames the unvax because they chose to exercise their right not to be forced to inject something into their body they don't want. Again, everyone has the right to believe what they want, what you don't have the right to do (at least here in the states) is to force your beliefs onto others.

 

And to say that it is because of the unvax that the virus is still around shows how far removed someone can be removed from reality and facts it.


I work in medical research and clinical care.

 

And my colleagues who who have worked in virology research for 20-30 years are well versed in the complex world of viruses, the covid virus is natural and is not spliced together and is traced back to bats.

 

But we are of the opinion it was leaked from the lab in Wulan, there were no outbreaks in the province where the bat caves were located, where the virus originated.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Janissary said:

 

There are two separate issues that you and other are anti-vaxers keep conflating. Also you keep deflecting the discussion by bringing up unrelated issues to create the illusion that pro-vaxers are peddling their unsubstantiated beliefs on you. This is not the case. 

 

(1) On the issue whether you have the right not to get vaccinated. Of course you do. Everyone does. 

 

(2) Regardless of whether you are exercising your right to not be vaccinated, there are facts you simply cannot ignore. These facts don't care about your political stance, if it is morally right or wrong for a government to require vaccination, or if you believe covid was man-made or not. The fact is vaccination provides protection against spread, hospitalization, and death. And by a lot! Death rates among the unvaccinated are significantly larger than those who have been vaccinated. These facts cannot be disputed.

 

I don't understand how anybody can make generalizations about their personal experiences to pass judgment about the validity of the facts around a global crisis. Again, you have the right not to be vaccinated, but that does not imply that unvaccinated are just as healthy as the vaccinated or other BS people keep peddling. 

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-to-compare-covid-deaths-for-vaccinated-and-unvaccinated-people/

 

https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths-by-vaccination

 

https://doh.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2022-02/421-010-CasesInNotFullyVaccinated.pdf. (Yes, data is from WA only, so please argue that this does not apply to the rest of U.S.).

 

So what are you precisely saying? 

 

To all others, if you are unvaccinated thinking this is a global hoax, and that you and your five friends are living fine unvaxxed, you just have to thank the billions who did the right thing and got vaxxed to slow down and control this virus. You're getting a free and fast ride away from death, and you think the car is stationary and the death is simply moving away from you. 


Why is there a higher percentage of deaths for unvax compared to vax.........because the vax wasn't available the first year of the virus yet they are all the deaths in the equation instead of just those that happened after the vax was available.

 

I like how you label anyone who is opposed to mandatory COVID vaccination as an "anti-vaxers", wonder what we can label pro-vaxer's........kool-aid drinkers?

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Scooby said:


I work in medical research and clinical care.

 

And my colleagues who who have worked in virology research for 20-30 years are well versed in the complex world of viruses, the covid virus is natural and is not spliced together and is traced back to bats.

 

But we are of the opinion it was leaked from the lab in Wulan, there were no outbreaks in the province where the bat caves were located, where the virus originated.

 

That's like saying "I stayed in a Holiday Express last night".

 

If it originated naturally from bats and was not manipulated by humans how come there was no cases from the province where the bat caves are located? Wouldn't you think that if it was a natural virus and was just brought to the lab and accidentally released from the lab that there would be cases in the area around the caves?

 

But hey, you believe what you want to believe and I'll believe what I want, in the end we'll just agree to disagree (if some people are still capable of that).

Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, GW8345 said:


Why is there a higher percentage of deaths for unvax compared to vax.........because the vax wasn't available the first year of the virus yet they are all the deaths in the equation instead of just those that happened after the vax was available.

 

I like how you label anyone who is opposed to mandatory COVID vaccination as an "anti-vaxers", wonder what we can label pro-vaxer's........kool-aid drinkers?

So let me understand this clearly: You think all the unvaccinated deaths prior to the vaccines becoming available are thrown into the mix when reporting unvax death rates, say the 1st week of March 2022. Is that so? This right there tells me you have zero understanding how to read charts, what death rate means, what a moving average is. Even a simple glimpse at the charts would have told you what you are saying is literally impossible. 

 

You're like a flat-earther. You know it is B.S., but you also know all the talking points, so you think you make sense by throwing out words you don't even understand to defend a position you know is indefensible. 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Janissary said:

So let me understand this clearly: You think all the unvaccinated deaths prior to the vaccines becoming available are thrown into the mix when reporting unvax death rates, say the 1st week of March 2022. Is that so? This right there tells me you have zero understanding how to read charts, what death rate means, what a moving average is. Even a simple glimpse at the charts would have told you what you are saying is literally impossible. 

 

You're like a flat-earther. You know it is B.S., but you also know all the talking points, so you think you make sense by throwing out words you don't even understand to defend a position you know is indefensible. 

 

Talking points uh, who is calling people "anti-vaxer's"?

 

And yes, I do believe they are "fudging" the numbers to make it look worse that what it really is.

 

You are like every other kool-aid drinker, you only believe what is served to you and are incapable of critical thinking.

Edited by GW8345
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, GW8345 said:

You are like every other kool-aid drinker, you only believe what is served to you and are incapable of critical thinking.

 

oh the irony - again...

 

I worked in clinical chemistry labs (blood work) for seven years, including the entire COVID pandemic.  I didn't drink any "kool-aid", I worked in hospitals with doctors and virologists on a daily basis.  That's where I got my information, from experts in the field of medicine.  Not from television, not from politicians, not from talking heads.

 

You should stick to ordnance.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, habu2 said:

 

oh the irony - again...

 

I worked in clinical chemistry labs (blood work) for seven years, including the entire COVID pandemic.  I didn't drink any "kool-aid", I worked in hospitals with doctors and virologists on a daily basis.  That's where I got my information, from experts in the field of medicine.  Not from television, not from politicians, not from talking heads.

 

You should stick to ordnance.

Just because you swept the floors in the lab and emptied the trash cans for the lab techs doesn't mean you become an overnight expert.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, GW8345 said:

Just because you swept the floors in the lab and emptied the trash cans for the lab techs doesn't mean you become an overnight expert.

 

Thanks for assuming my lowly status, and showing your inherent bias against others.

 

Just because you swept the deck and emptied ash trays for the real ordies doesn't mean you become an overnight expert.

 

Right back atcha...

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, habu2 said:

 

Thanks for assuming my lowly status, and showing your inherent bias against others.

 

Just because you swept the deck and emptied ash trays for the real ordies doesn't mean you become an overnight expert.

 

Right back atcha...

Yea, I did sweep the deck and emptied the ash trays for other ordies, it's called being a low ranking enlisted  sailor (Airman), which is the way every enlisted sailor started out.

 

And I'm not biased, I hate everyone equally. 😉

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...