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Need help Star & Bar size on AF SEA F-4 Phantoms


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I have to make new star and bars for an F-4C (not a model one) I help take care of. Everything I find shows the sizing for the pre SEA camo with 30" star.

Anyone know what size they went to when they went with SEA camo? Google has not been my friend today.

 

Thanks,

Mike

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This is for an actual F-4 Phantom, like restoration? I'd say if no one here can answer your question (which I bet someone can) then your best best is to ask the USAF Museum for questions of that nature. 

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Posted (edited)

Yep full-size real bird. Vietnam combat vet.

 

Museum is closed until June.

 

If It doesn’t workout here I’ll try other sources.

 

Mike

Edited by P-38 guy
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Based on the photos (not official documents), I calculated the insignia size on Vietnam and post-Vietnam era camouflaged Phantoms to be 15" star. I have been using this size in my products for years.

 

Note that a national insignia with a star diameter of 15" will end up being  16.875" high (15 x 1.125) on the aircraft when you factor in the border width etc.

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That’s what I was thinking too.

I have the diagram on how to make them.

I did 30” ones awhile back for the F-105B at my local airport. That thing was big when done. Lol

 

Thanks,

Mike

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Look up the tech order, T.O. 1-1-4, My wife got me one back when she was a C-130 crew chief at Little Rock in the 70s.  I just looked up the size in the T.O. and it calls for 15 inch stars unless you have a really big aircraft like a B-52.  This T.O. covers all the different type of markings that could have been used on all the Air Force aircraft in the inventory at the time.  This includes Tail Codes, warnings, serial number placement, camo patterns, colors and so on.  The actual camo patterns don't have to be exact, there was always some variation, and the national markings were either stenciled on or in the case of the larger markings, I have seen them apply what are essentially large stick on insignias.  You don't always have time to paint things on.

We have a F-4 on display here I town to honor Kittenger.  They called D.M and they sent a old F-4 that just happened to be one of his old rides that kad his kill marking on it.

 

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Posted (edited)

Here's a shot from the 1978 T.O. 1-1-4 (Link to full manual). The radius of the star you need will be 15", as others have said.

VkC5Ne4.jpg

 

The tail codes on the F-4 were 24". I can't recall how tall the serial numbers were, but the info is in the T.O. If you're painting the jet as it looked in the early days of the SEA camouflage scheme, before tail codes were used, the serial number ("USAF, with last five of the serial below) used 6" numbers and letters.

 

Stencils such as the aircraft data panel would be 1/2", IIRC. Kursad can correct me on that, since he's more familiar with it from his decal business.

 

Ben

Edited by Ben Brown
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Thanks for all the info. I have all the specs. Just needed the starting size for the star and bar. When we restored it in 2011. I painted but wasn't involved in getting the marking for the plane. The place that did them went out of business so I'm taking care of them since I did all the ones on the local F-105 we have.

 

From 2011.

ypsUv25.jpg

 

From 2019

gOMIqMT.jpg

 

Mike

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I think I've asked this before, but that Thud used to be displayed at an airport in western NC back in the '90s, didn't it? Or maybe the late '80s? I can't recall which employer I was working for when I saw it.

 

Ben

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