goondman Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Please excuse my ignorance, but I'm completely confused as to had what Did the F-14B Bombcat have the same cockpit as its 'D' counterpart? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tapchan Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I don't think so. There is a conversion set including the cockpit so it must be different. By logic it's a BOMBcat so RIO's pit may vary from other versions. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 The F-14B cockpit was essentially the same as the F-14A from a modeling standpoint. When LANTIRN hit the fleet, both the A and B received the square PTID screen. The D cockpit is a completely different animal. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
goondman Posted July 19, 2020 Author Share Posted July 19, 2020 5 hours ago, Darren Roberts said: The F-14B cockpit was essentially the same as the F-14A from a modeling standpoint. When LANTIRN hit the fleet, both the A and B received the square PTID screen. The D cockpit is a completely different animal. Gotcha, thank you! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brian P: Fightertown Decals Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Question is what timeframe are you trying to model? The original F-14A+/F-14B was very very similar to the A. And eventually the A would upgrade to look like the B. All Tomcats had the bomb capability so there really is no such thing as Bombcat. It's just a nickname recognizing that it added the AG mission later in life. In 1997/98 All Tomcats started getting Lantirn upgrades to allow autonomous PGM employment. So if you know what squadron and timeframe you are building, then you can narrow it down to what RIO backseat cockpit you need... cheers, brian Quote Link to post Share on other sites
goondman Posted July 20, 2020 Author Share Posted July 20, 2020 4 hours ago, Brian P: Fightertown Decals said: Question is what timeframe are you trying to model? The original F-14A+/F-14B was very very similar to the A. And eventually the A would upgrade to look like the B. All Tomcats had the bomb capability so there really is no such thing as Bombcat. It's just a nickname recognizing that it added the AG mission later in life. In 1997/98 All Tomcats started getting Lantirn upgrades to allow autonomous PGM employment. So if you know what squadron and timeframe you are building, then you can narrow it down to what RIO backseat cockpit you need... cheers, brian VF-102, OEF Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 On 7/19/2020 at 7:44 PM, goondman said: VF-102, OEF Pretty sure 102 was LANTIRN-equipped by that time, so you'd do an "A" pit with the added square screen and sidestick controller for the RIO. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slartibartfast Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 On 7/19/2020 at 4:57 PM, Brian P: Fightertown Decals said: All Tomcats had the bomb capability so there really is no such thing as Bombcat... cheers, brian Then where did "Not a pound for air to ground." come from? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 5 minutes ago, Slartibartfast said: Then where did "Not a pound for air to ground." come from? There was always a latent air-to-ground capability built in to the original design. There's a picture of a pre-production jet with a belly full of Snakeye bombs slung underneath. The phrase "Not a pound for air to ground" came from a disdain for the bombing mission. That was back when you had dedicated aircraft for each specific role. The F-14 was a "fighter", and it was going to be used that way. Looking back, it was a very short-sighted approach, given that just 10 years later everything would change and the focus would be on multi-mission aircraft. But, as they say, hindsight is 20/20. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
habu2 Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 1 hour ago, Slartibartfast said: Then where did "Not a pound for air to ground." come from? I thought that phrase originated with the early F-15 (not F-14) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GW8345 Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 I can confirm that VF-102's birds were LANTRIN equipped by the time OEF. I was in VF-143 and in 97 we transferred several of our birds (we were going from 16 jets down to 10) and the birds we transferred to -102 were LANTRIN equipped. I can also confirm that the Tomcat always had an air to ground capability, the air to ground system seemed (to me) to be based off of the A-7E air to ground system (the switchology was the same as the A-7E's). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Da SWO Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 8 hours ago, habu2 said: I thought that phrase originated with the early F-15 (not F-14) Correct, which is incredibly ironic when you look at "today's" new Eagles. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slartibartfast Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 Thanks for clarifying this old noggin. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 On 7/21/2020 at 10:13 PM, Da SWO said: Correct, which is incredibly ironic when you look at "today's" new Eagles. The F-15 adapted in time. The F-14 was a bit too late to the party. That's why the Eagle is still flying and the Tomcat isn't...or maybe it was because of Dick Cheney. 😡 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Da SWO Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 4 hours ago, Darren Roberts said: The F-15 adapted in time. The F-14 was a bit too late to the party. That's why the Eagle is still flying and the Tomcat isn't...or maybe it was because of Dick Cheney. 😡 I'll blame Darth Cheney for the Tomcat's demise. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
habu2 Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 8 hours ago, Da SWO said: I'll blame Darth Cheney for the Tomcat's demise. You can certainly “blame” Robert McNamara for the Tomcat’s creation!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 2 hours ago, habu2 said: You can certainly “blame” Robert McNamara for the Tomcat’s creation!!! No, he gets "credit" for it. 😄 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
eagledocf15 Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 (edited) On 7/23/2020 at 7:09 AM, Darren Roberts said: The F-15 adapted in time. The F-14 was a bit too late to the party. That's why the Eagle is still flying and the Tomcat isn't...or maybe it was because of Dick Cheney. 😡 The F-15 had the capability to drop bombs al along. The HUD even came with a "drop line" feature for "dumb" unguided bombs. I know two pilots who did the initial OT&E and found that the F-15 was a stable platform for bombing. That's when the split in funding took a turn (F-16 needing a tactical mission as well as a lightweight fighter. With the release of the fighter doctrine publication FM 100-20, air superiority has been the mission, and the theoretical doctrinal focus, of the USAF; WWII and the Korean War displayed the capabilities of a superior air-to-air fighter, while Vietnam left fighter pilots clamoring for a fighter that could “win in the unforgiving arena of air combat.” The F-15 Eagle was the first true air superiority fighter since the P-51, P-38, and the F-86. However, it grew from the F-X program, another Cold War-style fighter-bomber—heavy, fast, large payload, multi-role, reliant on radar and missile technology, not maneuverable in a dogfight, and expensive; essentially another F-111. The experiences of Vietnam helped Air Force leadership to refocus the program on air superiority, leading to the mantra, “not a pound for air-to-ground.” Regardless of the impetus for change, planners designed the F-15 as a pure air superiority fighter, with only very limited multi-role capability. When it was learned that the OTE was testing the capability for bombing, it was halted immediately and the HUD symbiology removed. The drive was for a true air superiority fighter, and other aircraft were designated as the "ground-pounders (A-7, A-10 being matured, etc.) No one wanted money diverted away from the A-10 as it was in competition with the Army's Helicopter gun platforms. They needed that political leverage and to have a dedicated CAS/tactical bombing platform. The plan paid off in spades as Israel learned with it's first F-15 kills. The first ever kill by an F-15 was scored by an Israeli Eagle in 1979 over Lebanon, followed, two years later by the first worldwide kill of a Mig-25 Foxbat. Israeli F-15s are credited with 60 air-to-air victories mainly against Syrian Mig-21, Mig-25 and Mig-23 jets.(Note: there may be more kills, but that remains a guarded secret.) F-15Cs performed air superiority missions throughout the gulf war, where they achieved 33 of the coalition’s 38 air-to-air kills. Sixteen of the 38 kills were BVR; the remainders were WVR, where a potential for combat maneuvering existed and occurred. Fighter aircraft development is influenced by politics and the perceived and projected needs at that time.. When the F-15 was first developed, there was a feeling there was a need for better air superiority fighters. But with time it was perceived that the focus had shifted to bombing campaigns and it was reconfigured as a strike aircraft. Thus the F-15E Strike Eagle. It actually built on some of the early lessons that were originally conceived for the "Light Grey Eagles". The adaptability was always there, and it just needed exploration. Edited March 4, 2021 by eagledocf15 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dan Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) From 1999-2003 64 F-14B equipping VF-32, VF-11, VF-143 VF-103 and VF-101 had the Sparrowhawk HUD installed. It was first used in an operation deployment in 2003 over Iraq. Similar in appearance to the F-14D HUD. The rest of the cockpit remained as it was except for the front windscreen which was changed to a glass more compatible with night vision googles as it was no longer used as the combiner for the original HUD. Edited March 5, 2021 by dan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
achterkirch Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-031213-n-3363h-002-atlantic-ocean-dec-13-2003-aviation-boatswains-130018600.html?pv=1&stamp=2&imageid=73D287B5-EC7B-4847-98B5-3A9A1AED9A74&p=370272&n=0&orientation=0&pn=1&searchtype=0&IsFromSearch=1&srch=foo%3dbar%26st%3d0%26pn%3d1%26ps%3d100%26sortby%3d2%26resultview%3dsortbyPopular%26npgs%3d0%26qt%3dvf%20143%20pukin%20dogs%26qt_raw%3dvf%20143%20pukin%20dogs%26lic%3d3%26mr%3d0%26pr%3d0%26ot%3d0%26creative%3d%26ag%3d0%26hc%3d0%26pc%3d%26blackwhite%3d%26cutout%3d%26tbar%3d1%26et%3d0x000000000000000000000%26vp%3d0%26loc%3d0%26imgt%3d0%26dtfr%3d%26dtto%3d%26size%3d0xFF%26archive%3d1%26groupid%3d%26pseudoid%3d%26a%3d%26cdid%3d%26cdsrt%3d%26name%3d%26qn%3d%26apalib%3d%26apalic%3d%26lightbox%3d%26gname%3d%26gtype%3d%26xstx%3d0%26simid%3d%26saveQry%3d%26editorial%3d1%26nu%3d%26t%3d%26edoptin%3d%26customgeoip%3d%26cap%3d1%26cbstore%3d1%26vd%3d0%26lb%3d%26fi%3d2%26edrf%3d%26ispremium%3d1%26flip%3d0%26pl%3d It’s an A aft cockpit but it’s pretty much the same as what the B would look like if I remember right. Edited March 5, 2021 by achterkirch Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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