Steve G Posted November 27, 2020 Share Posted November 27, 2020 So, I am a relative amateur here, and if this topic has been covered please let me know. Im looking for a safe, effective way to create the sag in the rotors of a a parked pave hawk. Last time I tried some "heat treating", it was over my toaster and I ruined a freaken tank! Also, for extra credit, are the rotors manufactured in Stratford at the plant? Or are they a Hamilton Standard or P&W product? Yes I live in CT. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Loach Driver Posted November 27, 2020 Share Posted November 27, 2020 (edited) Bending the blades by hand doesn't really work and never gives a uniform result, in my experience. One method I saw in a magazine involves using a couple of modelling clamps which you clamp together to form a sort of "jig". The rotor blade is then held in place at both ends by this combination of clamps. By adjusting the spacing of the clamps, you can adjust how much droop you want to impart to the blade. By using the same jig for each blade, you will get the same degree of sag in each blade. Once each blade is held in place in the jig with the desired bend in the blade, warm/hot water is poured over it or a hairdryer can also be used. Great care needs to be employed when using heat to droop plastic blades. It does work but I have also ruined rotor blades myself. I would start with a middle level of heat and slowly increase it from there until you hit the right temperature that will "just" soften the plastic a little. Juanjo Dominguez wrote an article on the 1/72 SH-60 and he used this system. He illustrated his method in a magazine I have featuring this build but I can't find a copy of the photos online. This is his model. http://www.hyperscale.com/2009/galleries/sh60b72jd_1.htm These are the clamps he used. I have a set and intend on trying this method on my current build. https://www.aviationmegastore.com/large-plastic-clamps-55664-excel-hobby-blades-0098171556648-aircraft-scale-modelling-tools/product/?action=prodinfo&art=19994 I hope this is helpful. LD. Edited November 27, 2020 by Loach Driver Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve G Posted November 28, 2020 Author Share Posted November 28, 2020 15 hours ago, Loach Driver said: Bending the blades by hand doesn't really work and never gives a uniform result, in my experience. One method I saw in a magazine involves using a couple of modelling clamps which you clamp together to form a sort of "jig". The rotor blade is then held in place at both ends by this combination of clamps. By adjusting the spacing of the clamps, you can adjust how much droop you want to impart to the blade. By using the same jig for each blade, you will get the same degree of sag in each blade. Once each blade is held in place in the jig with the desired bend in the blade, warm/hot water is poured over it or a hairdryer can also be used. Great care needs to be employed when using heat to droop plastic blades. It does work but I have also ruined rotor blades myself. I would start with a middle level of heat and slowly increase it from there until you hit the right temperature that will "just" soften the plastic a little. Juanjo Dominguez wrote an article on the 1/72 SH-60 and he used this system. He illustrated his method in a magazine I have featuring this build but I can't find a copy of the photos online. This is his model. http://www.hyperscale.com/2009/galleries/sh60b72jd_1.htm These are the clamps he used. I have a set and intend on trying this method on my current build. https://www.aviationmegastore.com/large-plastic-clamps-55664-excel-hobby-blades-0098171556648-aircraft-scale-modelling-tools/product/?action=prodinfo&art=19994 I hope this is helpful. LD. Thanks for the response, the part when it says "great care" makes me nervous but ill try it. First im going to see how they lay without any mods. While I got ya, will you recommend a good Hughes 500 kit? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HeavyArty Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 (edited) I find the KH blades droop just enough under their own weight. They look right to me straight from the box. Edited November 28, 2020 by HeavyArty Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Loach Driver Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 16 hours ago, Steve G said: Thanks for the response, the part when it says "great care" makes me nervous but ill try it. First im going to see how they lay without any mods. While I got ya, will you recommend a good Hughes 500 kit? Which scale did you have in mind? LD. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve G Posted November 29, 2020 Author Share Posted November 29, 2020 On 11/28/2020 at 11:59 AM, Loach Driver said: Which scale did you have in mind? LD. As big as I can within reason. I like anything bigger than 1/48. Remember Im an amateur. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Winnie Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 The blades are manufactured by Sikorsky, or a sub-contractor. The most popular aftermarket blades for S-61 Helicopters are made by Carson, but they are recognized by downswept tips and red and white paint on top. Obviously not available for the H-60 series. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve G Posted December 3, 2020 Author Share Posted December 3, 2020 5 hours ago, Winnie said: The blades are manufactured by Sikorsky, or a sub-contractor. The most popular aftermarket blades for S-61 Helicopters are made by Carson, but they are recognized by downswept tips and red and white paint on top. Obviously not available for the H-60 series. Thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Loach Driver Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 On 11/29/2020 at 9:57 PM, Steve G said: As big as I can within reason. I like anything bigger than 1/48. Remember Im an amateur. Sorry for the slow reply. In the big scales, you have four options; 1/35th, the Dragon series of kits and the Kitty Hawk pair of Little Birds 1/32nd, Revell's old OH-6A kit 1/24th, Hobbycraft's Hughes 500D series 1/20th scale, the Nichimo Hughes 500C. The 1/35th Dragon series include kits for the OH-6A, 500M-D TOW Defender, 530MG MMS Defender and the 500E. These kits are buildable but do require a little modelling skill to get a good result. They are fairly accurate but the skids are not the perfect shape at the front bend where the skids curve upwards. Not a deal breaker. Overall quite nice and leave plenty of room for scratch built detail. The 1/32nd scale kit from Revell is very old (dates from the 1960's) and so is fairly simplistic. The fuselage shape seems to be accurate as is the windscreen profile. Beyond those parts, you would need to replace most other components with scratch-built parts to bring the level of detail and accuracy up to modern standard. 1/24th scale Hobbycraft - get in your car, point it in the opposite direction to the kit and drive as fast as you can for as long as you can. This kit is more of a very basic construction model for younger modellers and is not really a model kit as we know it. The fuselage shape may be reasonably accurate but the rest of the kit is overly simplistic and is best avoided. Unless you are a master scratch builder with the patience of Job, there is no hope of building a passable model from this kit. The Nichimo 1/20th scale Hughes 500C is an old Japanese kit that was produced in the 1970's and is long out of production. It is very well detailed for the time and features very good detail in the cockpit and cabin and has a pretty much fully-detailed engine included. It appears to be very accurate in shape and would result in a fine model. It could be converted into an OH-6A or Hughes 500D but would need some skill to do so. It is not cheap but it is what I would consider to be a "Super-Kit". Oddly enough, they turn up on ebay at a very regular rate. Somebody, somewhere, must have a container load of old kits that never sold back in the day because there is a slow but steady supply of kits on ebay over the last ten years. They often go for more than $300 but sub-$200 bargains can be had. $150 or thereabouts is a fair price for this kit, I reckon. I hope this is of assistance. LD. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve G Posted December 7, 2020 Author Share Posted December 7, 2020 4 hours ago, Loach Driver said: Sorry for the slow reply. In the big scales, you have four options; 1/35th, the Dragon series of kits and the Kitty Hawk pair of Little Birds 1/32nd, Revell's old OH-6A kit 1/24th, Hobbycraft's Hughes 500D series 1/20th scale, the Nichimo Hughes 500C. The 1/35th Dragon series include kits for the OH-6A, 500M-D TOW Defender, 530MG MMS Defender and the 500E. These kits are buildable but do require a little modelling skill to get a good result. They are fairly accurate but the skids are not the perfect shape at the front bend where the skids curve upwards. Not a deal breaker. Overall quite nice and leave plenty of room for scratch built detail. The 1/32nd scale kit from Revell is very old (dates from the 1960's) and so is fairly simplistic. The fuselage shape seems to be accurate as is the windscreen profile. Beyond those parts, you would need to replace most other components with scratch-built parts to bring the level of detail and accuracy up to modern standard. 1/24th scale Hobbycraft - get in your car, point it in the opposite direction to the kit and drive as fast as you can for as long as you can. This kit is more of a very basic construction model for younger modellers and is not really a model kit as we know it. The fuselage shape may be reasonably accurate but the rest of the kit is overly simplistic and is best avoided. Unless you are a master scratch builder with the patience of Job, there is no hope of building a passable model from this kit. The Nichimo 1/20th scale Hughes 500C is an old Japanese kit that was produced in the 1970's and is long out of production. It is very well detailed for the time and features very good detail in the cockpit and cabin and has a pretty much fully-detailed engine included. It appears to be very accurate in shape and would result in a fine model. It could be converted into an OH-6A or Hughes 500D but would need some skill to do so. It is not cheap but it is what I would consider to be a "Super-Kit". Oddly enough, they turn up on ebay at a very regular rate. Somebody, somewhere, must have a container load of old kits that never sold back in the day because there is a slow but steady supply of kits on ebay over the last ten years. They often go for more than $300 but sub-$200 bargains can be had. $150 or thereabouts is a fair price for this kit, I reckon. I hope this is of assistance. LD. Thank you for this! I haven't built a Dragon but they look like where i'm headed. Ive never heard of Nichimo but I am an ebayer and will check that out. Ive made it a point to finish the HH60 by Christmas so that may be my next build. If it weren't for this forum I would have given up on aircraft altogether because of my experience with this KH kit. So I will try again. When I opened the KH HH60 i was overwhelmed with excitement because of the detail. If they ever get the instructions locked in I will probably buy another, but it really dealt a blow to my confidence, and i'm not too happy on how its turning out. Thanks again! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Helo-Engineer Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 On 12/2/2020 at 1:37 PM, Winnie said: The blades are manufactured by Sikorsky, or a sub-contractor. The most popular aftermarket blades for S-61 Helicopters are made by Carson, but they are recognized by downswept tips and red and white paint on top. Obviously not available for the H-60 series. Blades are all made by Sikorsky in the Stratford plant for every current model. Pretty impressive setup there. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve G Posted December 14, 2020 Author Share Posted December 14, 2020 48 minutes ago, Helo-Engineer said: Blades are all made by Sikorsky in the Stratford plant for every current model. Pretty impressive setup there. That Id like to see, just the blades. My unit transitioned from Hueys to Blackhawks when i was in the service but I didnt pay too much attention as they were merely taxis for us. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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