Waco Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 GW8345: “People disagree with me in this conversation, so I’m ridiculing them and shutting down the conversation, and going back to my echo chamber where everyone agrees with me. Have a blessed day.” You too, fam. Link to post Share on other sites
ChernayaAkula Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 6 hours ago, GW8345 said: Wow, I see the concept of individual freedom is an unknown thing to some. <...> Wow, I see the concept of personal responsibility is an unknown thing to some. Whatever happened to "do unto others"? 1 hour ago, Dave Roof said: Here is what I find interesting about many of yours, as well as a couple others comments. Why is it so difficult for those of you that choose to get the vaccine to simply accept that some of us choose not to? Because herd immunity is a thing? Because it's not just a personal choice? Because some people choosing not to take a safe vaccine means the virus will always have a it can infect. Where it can mutate. Meaning it will never leave. Much like the flu. Well done! Super work! *insert-Congratulations-You've-played-yourself-meme* If we don't stamp out this virus this time around, then - yes - it will be here to stay. Meaning - yes - further vaccinations may well be necessary. 1 hour ago, Dave Roof said: <....> As you've shown that you can't have a disagreement without resorting to personal jabs, this will be my last comment on the matter. I wish you well.<.... Ooooh, nice dramatic "I'm leaving!!!!" post. 1 hour ago, GW8345 said: I can answer that for you Dave, Because in some folks minds anyone with dissenting opinions or points of view must be ridiculed and shut down because they have never learned that not everyone thinks the way they do. They can't imagine anyone with differing opinions and views because they live in an echo chamber and have never been around anyone who doesn't think like they do. It use to be people would respect other's opinions and would agree to disagree when they had different views. Now a days, some think that everyone has to think the way they do and if you don't, then they think they have the right (and duty) to ridicule and demean you because they have never been taught to accept differing opinions/POV. Those who think that way are on full display in this thread. <...> Facts > opinions. 1+1=2. You may be of the opinion that 1+1=3. You are free to say that. That doesn't mean anyone has any obligation whatsoever to listen to you saying it. The only one ridiculing you is... you. 1 hour ago, GW8345 said: <....> With that said, this is my last post in this thread, may you have a blessed day. Nice! And people say there are no good news these days. Link to post Share on other sites
Da SWO Posted February 12, 2021 Share Posted February 12, 2021 1 hour ago, ChernayaAkula said: Wow, I see the concept of personal responsibility is an unknown thing to some. Whatever happened to "do unto others"? Because herd immunity is a thing? Because it's not just a personal choice? Because some people choosing not to take a safe vaccine means the virus will always have a it can infect. Where it can mutate. Meaning it will never leave. Much like the flu. Well done! Super work! *insert-Congratulations-You've-played-yourself-meme* If we don't stamp out this virus this time around, then - yes - it will be here to stay. Meaning - yes - further vaccinations may well be necessary. Ooooh, nice dramatic "I'm leaving!!!!" post. Facts > opinions. 1+1=2. You may be of the opinion that 1+1=3. You are free to say that. That doesn't mean anyone has any obligation whatsoever to listen to you saying it. The only one ridiculing you is... you. Nice! And people say there are no good news these days. Research the US forcing military members to take the swine flu or anthrax vaccine. There is a good reason some of us are skeptical and willing to wait. As far as do unto others, maybe you should ask the President of China why they allowed it to go global? Link to post Share on other sites
WymanV Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, GW8345 said: Also, the survival rate for the virus is 98.7% and that's without a vaccine being readily available, doesn't sound so deadly to me. Fatality rate aside, I don't know why so many people are so determined to get sick in the first place. I'll pass, thankyouverymuch. I don't have time to be laid up by something I could have avoided. Got all my vaccines when I was a kid; got all the vaccines at boot camp and at 57 YO I've yet to experience an ill affect from any of them. Edited February 13, 2021 by WymanV no preview feature Link to post Share on other sites
ChernayaAkula Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Da SWO said: Research the US forcing military members to take the swine flu or anthrax vaccine. There is a good reason some of us are skeptical and willing to wait. <...> In case of the COVID vaccinations, no, there is no reason to be sceptical. The vaccines have been approved by various different agencies in various nations, independently and thoroughly. When the vaccines were still in trial stages they were monitored and considered safe. That they were developed so quickly does not mean they were rushed. They simply did some steps in parallel or overlapping that would under normal circumstances only occur after each other. Up to to today, more than 160 million doses of vaccine have been administered (SOURCE). That means at the very least about 80 million people (assuming all got two doses) have gotten their jab(s.) Even more if you consider that a sizeable number have only had their first jab. There are no serious reported side effects. AIUI, none of those that got COVID after they were vaccinated died or needed hospitalization. Okay. Swine flu and anthrax. Are you talking about the 1976 swine flu pandemic that didn't turn out to be a pandemic? Anthrax. In light of Desert Storm and since? These situations are not comparable to today's issue, I think. There has been no unethical treatment concerning the Corona vaccines today, neither in the studies leading to their certification nor in their administration. Also, AIUI, the vaccines used in those programmes are vastly different to those currently used to battle Corona. Anthrax. Apparently easily weaponized. There was fear Iraq would use them as a biological weapon against US forces. It was felt the possible danger was big enough to warrant vaccinations. Whether or not these administered unethically I can't say. AFAIK, Anthrax weapons were not utilized. In hindsight, these vaccinations were unnecessary Corona, on the other hand, is not a mere probability. Nobody is denying it's a pandemic (at least not any longer). It's a fact. We know it's dangerous. Even if you don't die, there can be terrible lasting illness. We know the vaccines are safe. Wherever there is medical ethical misconduct, it needs to be investigated and brought to light. Not just with regards to soldiers, but unethical testing everywhere. 1 hour ago, Da SWO said: <...> As far as do unto others, maybe you should ask the President of China why they allowed it to go global? Sorry to be blunt, but pointing at someone who failed to do the right thing in the past (immediate or not) to explain why you don't want to do the right thing now is - again, I'm sorry - kindergarten level of reasoning. It doesn't get us anywhere. Especially at the present point in time. It's the old crying over spilt milk thing. The milk has been spilt. Yes, we can argue over who spilt the milk - and we should, as well as discussing how to make sure no further milk is spilt -, but that doesn't get it off the floor, does it? Only... it's not milk. It's a fire that's not only likely to consume the house it was started in, not only the neighbourhood, but the whole city. That China acted too late and didn't stop the fire from spreading is one thing. To stand there with crossed arms arguing that China really should have been more careful - while your own house has already caught fire - and decline the fire extinguisher (that's been proven safe by different, independent agencies) is... beyond words. The bit where we discuss how not to have fires spread the way this one did comes after the fire has been doused. While it is still burning we either help extinguishing or at least not stand in the way of those that do. With the vaccines we have a way of making it much, much harder to set things afire. Not 100% impossible to catch fire, but almost 100% guaranteed that things will not burn to the ground. And what if I asked the President of China and what if he actually answered? Assuming he even said, yeah, we f***ed it up, sorry. What then? Would that solve anything? Will the dead suddenly rise? Will the chronically ill suddenly be healthy again? Will anyone get back the time or money they spent battling this f***ing virus? No. Okay. It definitely won't change the past. Will it change the present? Will the vaccinations pick up speed? Will it stop the virus from spreading? Will it stop the virus from mutating? Also no. The virus will continue to take its toll. People are going to die of this virus. Some survivors are going to have lasting illnesses. And it will all take longer when people choose not get vaccinated. So why point at the President of China at all? It's so cheap. So dirt f***ing cheap. Especially since you know he's never going to apologize, let alone compensate anyone (as if you could compensate the loss of a loved one). And it's not going to solve a single thing. We have to combat this virus. All of us. The harder, the better (and also the quicker). Stay distanced as much as humanly possible. Wear your mask. Get vaccinated as soon as possible. If we can beat the virus quickly and thoroughly, this could be a one-time event. If we can't stamp it out quickly, it may come to haunt us yearly, like the flu. If it has enough reservoirs in unvaccinated people, it may even mutate in a way that the current vaccines are rendered ineffective (Thank you, anti-vaxxer measles moms and your 15 minutes of Facebook "research"). Thankfully, it is possible to something about it. To quote/translate German punk band Die Ärzte: It's not your fault the world is the way it is. It is your fault if it stays that way. Link to post Share on other sites
Hajo L. Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 Amen, Moritz! HAJO Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 On 2/10/2021 at 8:18 PM, habu2 said: I have a letter verifying I'm a front-line healthcare worker but the county's distribution process is so F'd I'm waiting until they get their act together. That and work has had me so busy I haven't had time to go through the sign-up process to get an appointment. The county did such a bad job other organizations have stepped in to help dispense the vaccine and things are getting better, but they still have a long way to go. Canada has screwed it up too, both my wife and I are also frontline healthcare workers. My wife is an RN in an ICU unit, she got her first shot but the second shot is screwed up (they don’t have stock). The first shot shouldn’t have been provided without the second secured, Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 21 hours ago, A-10 LOADER said: I'm right there with ya brother. Since 5 of my 6 Anthrax vaccines were all "tainted" batches and I now have GWS, along with chemical exposure, I'm vaccine adverse these days. Steve I don’t have GWS but I took the vaccines. And yes, GWS is real. It is well known that hydroxychloroquine was one such drug. In Canada I’m named in a Class Action lawsuit because research has shown that drug was a contributor. I do work in medicine and work with infectious disease. I do trust vaccines. Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 20 hours ago, Waco said: GW8345: asks for expert opinion receives expert opinions GW8345: “no, not like that” You are as charming as ever, Reddog. Tighten up them tin foil hats boys! It’s gonna stay bumpy for a long time at this rate... I wish this site had a like button. Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 19 hours ago, Dave Roof said: Here is what I find interesting about many of yours, as well as a couple others comments. Why is it so difficult for those of you that choose to get the vaccine to simply accept that some of us choose not to? Do you really think the condescending attitude or childish name calling is going to change our minds? Seriously, I have no problem with those of you that will get it and respect your decision to do so. However, you don't get to decide what is best for me, nor do you or anyone else get to dictate what I should or shouldn't do. And you have the nerve to call me self righteous? You don't have to agree with my decision, but you have no choice other than to accept it. As you've shown that you can't have a disagreement without resorting to personal jabs, this will be my last comment on the matter. I wish you well. Why didn’t you refuse before you deployed for the Gulf War? Link to post Share on other sites
A-10 LOADER Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Scooby said: Why didn’t you refuse before you deployed for the Gulf War? We didn't have that option, we were forced to get the Anthrax vaccines. GOOGLE "Direct Order" documentary, it's a 45 minute film narrated by Michael Douglas. It explains a lot, this is still going on to this day in our military btw and, after watching the documentary maybe you'll understand why we feel the way we do. Steve Edited February 13, 2021 by A-10 LOADER Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 16 minutes ago, A-10 LOADER said: We didn't have that option, we were forced to get the Anthrax vaccines. GOOGLE "Direct Order", it's a 45 minute film narrated by Michael Douglas. It explains a lot, this is still going on to this day in our military btw and, after watching the documentary maybe you'll understand why we feel the way we do. Steve My understanding is if you refused you didn’t deploy and were released. Link to post Share on other sites
A-10 LOADER Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Scooby said: My understanding is if you refused you didn’t deploy and were released. It wasn't that cut and dry. Like I said, watch the documentary, it explains everything. Steve Edited February 13, 2021 by A-10 LOADER Link to post Share on other sites
ChernayaAkula Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) The situation is different now, though. No one is being forced. The vaccines are safe. Weaponized Anthrax was a probability. The Corona pandemic is already in full swing. And it may well stay in full swing or turn into a recurring event if we don't act NOW. Edited February 13, 2021 by ChernayaAkula Link to post Share on other sites
A-10 LOADER Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 1 minute ago, ChernayaAkula said: The situation is different now, though. No one is being forced. The vaccines are safe. Weaponized Anthtax was a probability. The Corona pandemic is already in full swing. And it may well stay in full swing or turn into a recurring event if we don't act NOW. They said the Anthrax vaccine was safe too and, if it was a probability why haven't we found any WMD in 18 years ? Steve Link to post Share on other sites
fasteagle12 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 On 2/10/2021 at 12:04 PM, goondman said: Got my second yesterday, and do i feel like $hit today. I can only imagine what the actual virus is like Back to the original question....I get my 2nd shot tomorrow.. I'll let you know how it comes out... Link to post Share on other sites
ChernayaAkula Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, A-10 LOADER said: They said the Anthrax vaccine was safe too and, if it was a probability why haven't we found any WMD in 18 years ? Steve What they said about the Anthrax vaccine is one thing. What we know about the Corona vaccines is another. At least 160 million administered doses without any reported serious side effects. Certified by independent authorities in various countries. As for the WMDs.... I mean, yeah, none found after OIF. On the other hand, Iraqi use of WMDs against Kurds and Iranians in the 1980s are confirmed. Use against US/Coalition forces was a definite possibility. That they weren't used is one of those hindsight things. Corona, however, is not a possibility. It's a reality. And it's killing people by the thousands. And will continue to do so if we don't act now. The quicker and more decisive we act, the sooner it will be over. Edited February 13, 2021 by ChernayaAkula Link to post Share on other sites
SBARC Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 On 2/12/2021 at 9:34 AM, GW8345 said: Also, the survival rate for the virus is 98.7% and that's without a vaccine being readily available, doesn't sound so deadly to me. I do 100% respect each persons choice to not get the covid-19 vaccine. I wish they would for the sake of herd immunity, but I know many won't. I doubt this nugget of information I quoted above is accurate. As of today 27,500,000 Americans have been tested and infected with covid-19 and 481,000 Americans have died. That is a death rate of 1.74%. Now if every single American had already been infected with covid-19 then 481,000 dead Americans would match your 1.74% death rate nugget of information perfectly. But have every single American been infected so far? I seriously doubt every single American has been infected with Covid-19 at this point. Now you can dance around the number that 481,000 dead is fake news etc and that many of those people died of the flu etc. But I am unaware of a flu season that saw the hospitals worldwide overwhelmed like we have seen in the past year. If this is a hoax, then it is very well done to include every country worldwide....congrats to who ever created such a successful hoax. I have a co-worker that has had a double lung transplant. Due to this he is unable to take the vaccine. I will get the Covid-19 vaccine not just to protect myself, I will get it to protect him. All of his co-workers will get the vaccine to try our best to keep him safe. I do expect that international travel will be denied to anyone that isn't 100% up to date on the annual Covid-19 vaccinations. Currently you need a yellow fever injection or you are not permitted to travel to Africa. I suspect Covid-19 will be the same situation with annual vaccines to protect against the latest Covid-19 variants. Heck there is a surprisingly high % of people in longterm care homes in Canada that are not getting the Covid-19 vaccine by choice and 74% of all Covid-19 deaths in Canada were in longterm care homes. AIDS came out around 1980 and the world has never been the same. We will never go back to the way it was before Covid-19. This new reality is here to stay. Masks are a new reality for those that choose to wear them. I do 100% respect each persons choice to not get the covid-19 vaccine. I wish they would for the sake of herd immunity, but I know many won't. Link to post Share on other sites
SBARC Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 On 2/12/2021 at 9:34 AM, GW8345 said: Maybe if those "experts" stop putting out contradictory information and stop being wrong all the time more people will listen to what they have to say. This is the saddest part of all this. The mismanagement by leaders and experts. This virus should not have been allowed to spread beyond Wuhan and should have at least been contained to China. All international travel should have been denied to anyone holding a Chinese passport. Sure travel from China was restricted by some countries, but Chinese citizens simply flew from China to Thailand then flew to the US etc to get around the travel restrictions. Cloth masks were worn for the 1918 flu but so some odd reason masks were discouraged for this virus that was obviously spread through the air like a flu. Once this virus began to spread.....the word should have gone out to all grandmothers and avid sewers to make masks by the millions for their family and friends to protect the ones they love. This is what would have been done during WW2....mobilize the local populations to fight this virus from the beginning at the grassroots level. All citizens worldwide should have been encouraged to wear a cloth mask back in Feb 2020. Cloth masks were not encouraged until this virus began to get totally out of control in some areas on this planet (Italy, New York etc). Link to post Share on other sites
A-10 LOADER Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 I'm not looking to pick a fight with anyone on this subject. I can only say my opinion on why I won't be getting the shot. I already have enough health issues from my military service that cause me to be unemployable. I'm just not willing to take the chance and add to my issues and be an even bigger burden on my family. I'm finished commenting on this subject. Steve Link to post Share on other sites
SBARC Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 11 minutes ago, A-10 LOADER said: I'm not looking to pick a fight with anyone on this subject. I can only say my opinion on why I won't be getting the shot. I already have enough health issues from my military service that cause me to be unemployable. I'm just not willing to take the chance and add to my issues and be an even bigger burden on my family. I'm finished commenting on this subject. Steve I know 2 Vietnam Vets that died from Agent Orange exposure during their time in the USAF during the Vietnam era. This is why I fully understand and respect your choice in this matter. To get herd immunity we need about 65 or 70%...not 100% so I remain hopeful. Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) On 2/12/2021 at 12:11 PM, Raptor01 said: I am with Dave & Steve, my brothers! Two full books of International Certificates du Vaccines stamped on every page, don't even know what some of the older ones were anymore. Chinese Originated Viral Infectious Disease vaccinators are in for a surprise when they tell you this will be required annually for full protection and you will have to start paying for it. Nothing natural about this virus, sheeple can believe what they are told, I will take the vaccine when the government admits that is was weaponized manipulated bio-weapon engineered with US funding in a research laboratory designed by France funded by the EU. John You left out Bill Gates, George Soros, the Lincoln Project and pedophile, devil-worshiping politicians. Edited February 13, 2021 by 11bee Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 On 2/10/2021 at 12:04 PM, goondman said: Got my second yesterday, and do i feel like $hit today. I can only imagine what the actual virus is like I have not had mine, and now have doubts about even getting them. Most everybody I know that got them had issues. gary Link to post Share on other sites
ARCAccount#1 Posted February 14, 2021 Share Posted February 14, 2021 Pfizer and Moderna vaccines see 47 and 19 cases of anaphylaxis out of ~10 million and ~7.5 million doses. With numbers like these, I didn't hesitate to get the Moderna shot when I did. Worth it. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2776557?guestAccessKey=b2690d5a-5e0b-4d0b-8bcb-e4ba5bc96218&utm_source=For_The_Media&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=ftm_links&utm_content=tfl&utm_term=021221 Link to post Share on other sites
Waco Posted February 14, 2021 Share Posted February 14, 2021 1 hour ago, ChesshireCat said: I have not had mine, and now have doubts about even getting them. Most everybody I know that got them had issues. gary Define “issues.” Side effects are generally mild to moderate, and short term. 24-48 hours later, they are largely gone. They are also roughly equivalent to the side effects common to a wide range of vaccinations: injection site pain, low grade fever/chills, fatigue....etc. Almost all those who get these adverse reactions are quickly over them. It’s still better than getting COVID. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts