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Anyone else get their covid vaccines yet?


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55 minutes ago, ChesshireCat said:

not completely safe. 13 people died in Norway after receiving the shots

gary

 

Berkut's entry earlier in this thread:

 

On 2/14/2021 at 2:39 PM, Berkut said:

For example here in Norway it was reported a few weeks that 13 (iirc, pluss or minus few cases) people died shortly after getting their shots. This was at nursing homes for those that are especially in bad health shape (short term hospice). Those 13 cases are just under investigation, doesn't necessarily mean they died as a result of the vaccine itself, they were in extremely frail condition from before. Now, there is an argument to be made whether it is worth the risk to vaccinate those especially frail but that is up to the medical community and seems to me they have made they correct risk assessment.

 

That 13 number made its rounds around the world without context and it was automatically attributed to the vaccine. Another important number that was ignored however is that on average 400 people die in these short-term nursing homes per week due to their frail health, from "natural" causes, completely without a scary vaccine.

 

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On 2/15/2021 at 4:54 PM, ChesshireCat said:

not completely safe. 13 people died in Norway after receiving the shots

gary

2qsmmu0.gif

 dude, you are literally proving my point;

 

Quote

One has to be careful with wording and statements on this because this kind of data is very very easy to take out of context. And if this thread is anything to go by ("2% doesnt sound too deadly to me") average people have very very poor understanding of numbers and statistics in general.

 

Re-read what i wrote about that number (and one reply was specifically to you!!!), slowly this time. My God.

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3 hours ago, ChesshireCat said:

not completely safe. 13 people died in Norway after receiving the shots

gary


They didn’t die due to the vaccine. I can guarantee that everyone who gets the vaccine will die someday.

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Even if 13 people in Norway really did die from the vaccine, I'll take those odds against the 2,800,000+ that have died from COVID worldwide.

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19 hours ago, Scooby said:


They didn’t die due to the vaccine. I can guarantee that everyone who gets the vaccine will die someday.

It is a well known fact that 100% of those that get any vaccine die. It is also a fact that 100% of those that ingest dihydrogen monoxide die, sometimes a painful death. Ban dihydrogen monoxide NOW!

 

http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html

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On 2/15/2021 at 4:28 PM, ChesshireCat said:

(actually the regular flue kills more people than COVID-19 could dream of). I'm more worried about pneumonia than anything else.

gary

What has lead you to this conclusion that the regular flue kills more people than COVID-19?  Admittedly, I don't have any statistics to reference right now, but as far as I know, the regular flue does not fill up ICU beds affecting a hospital's capability to function.  My local hospital even had a refrigeration truck at one point to store more bodies as the morgue was full, which I haven't heard of the flu causing either.

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On 2/14/2021 at 5:39 PM, SBARC said:

I do admit I am interested in the Johnson and Johnson vaccine.  No one has died from covid after taking it and it is only 1 shot and is easier to transport.  For me the goal is to stop deaths or serious illness.  It does not prevent the illness as well as the other vaccines, but it's other attributes seem appealing.

last I heard the death rate was .00017 deaths per hundred cases. Pretty good odds when you think of it. Your chances of croaking from pneumonia or the generic flue are much greater. Add to this the well known fact that at least 40% of the cases filed are false claims. It's a way to scam the Fed for an extra 30% in money. 

 

I got HN1 horse flue in Vietnam about six weeks after taking my second shot over there. Hit me like a sledge hammer, and they gave me somekind of a high powered shot in the rear (SF MASH unit). Three days later I was good as new, but it was real ugly the first day. Top was sure I was gold bricking, and the medic told him he thought I was gonna die. What was in the shot; I just don't know. It's needed in the states. When I came home, I was exposed to the Hong Kong Flue and of course got it. That's when I figured out that flue shots were just guess work, and a way for the big pharma corporations to make money. 

gary

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Nope, it only just landed on our shores yesterday here in Oz.

 

Front line workers get it first.  We will be way down the list.

 

Hardly any cases here anyway, though the state of Victoria goes into lockdown every time someone sneezes.  Very interesting differences here between state governments (Labor = lockdown at will, Coalition = far less prone to blanket lockdowns).  Must be terrible to be a small hospitality business in some states here - whether you can open or not is a day to day proposition.  Hopefully the vaccine will end all this - though I guarantee the virus will still be out there for years.

 

At some point, govts here are going to have to set an end-game.

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1 hour ago, Benner said:

What has lead you to this conclusion that the regular flue kills more people than COVID-19?  Admittedly, I don't have any statistics to reference right now, but as far as I know, the regular flue does not fill up ICU beds affecting a hospital's capability to function.  My local hospital even had a refrigeration truck at one point to store more bodies as the morgue was full, which I haven't heard of the flu causing either.

that concept has been stated by the CDC, and hundreds of times as well by doctors all over the place. 

glt

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49 minutes ago, ChesshireCat said:

that concept has been stated by the CDC, and hundreds of times as well by doctors all over the place. 

glt

And yet some folks still keep comparing it to the flu.   

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1 hour ago, ChesshireCat said:

that concept has been stated by the CDC, and hundreds of times as well by doctors all over the place. 

glt

Are you saying the CDC has stated the concept that the flu is more dangerous than Covid-19?

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2 hours ago, ChesshireCat said:

last I heard the death rate was .00017 deaths per hundred cases.


This number is off by a factor of 10,000. The current US mortality rate is about 1.5%. Word wide 1-2% is commonly quoted. Up to to about 4% has been reported, although that was mostly earlier in the pandemic. 
 

So this number means for every 100 COVID cases, 1-2 people die. 

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2 hours ago, ChesshireCat said:

that concept has been stated by the CDC, and hundreds of times as well by doctors all over the place. 

glt

 

 

 

 

 

That is incorrect, from the CDC website:  Patients with COVID-19 had almost 19 times the risk for acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS) than did patients with influenza, (adjusted risk ratio [aRR] = 18.60; 95% confidence interval [CI] = 12.40–28.00), and more than twice the risk for myocarditis (2.56; 1.17–5.59), deep vein thrombosis (2.81; 2.04–3.87), pulmonary embolism (2.10; 1.53–2.89), intracranial hemorrhage (2.85; 1.35–6.03), acute hepatitis/liver failure (3.13; 1.92–5.10), bacteremia (2.46; 1.91–3.18), and pressure ulcers (2.65; 2.14–3.27). The risks for exacerbations of asthma (0.27; 0.16–0.44) and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD) (0.37; 0.32–0.42) were lower among patients with COVID-19 than among those with influenza. The percentage of COVID-19 patients who died while hospitalized (21.0%) was more than five times that of influenza patients (3.8%), and the duration of hospitalization was almost three times longer for COVID-19 patients.

mm6942e3_FluVsCOVID19Complications_IMAGE_20Oct20_1200x675-medium.jpg

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On 2/15/2021 at 6:29 PM, Scooby said:


They didn’t die due to the vaccine. I can guarantee that everyone who gets the vaccine will die someday.

 

same with those who don't. Really makes you think 

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On 2/16/2021 at 3:28 PM, Benner said:

What has lead you to this conclusion that the regular flue kills more people than COVID-19?  Admittedly, I don't have any statistics to reference right now, but as far as I know, the regular flue does not fill up ICU beds affecting a hospital's capability to function.  My local hospital even had a refrigeration truck at one point to store more bodies as the morgue was full, which I haven't heard of the flu causing either.

 

 

to be fair do you expect the hospital to call up the news to tell them their morgue is overflowing every flu season? Hospitals don't exactly brag about bad things. This is the limitation of our anecdotal knowledge. think about how many millions of things take place daily and go completely unheard by the all seeing, all knowing individual, in this case yourself. One could positively conclude that if you have not "heard it". Then surely it does not exist. I had never heard of Canada for years of my early life as well. but it was there ... just existing without my knowledge, which takes some real nerve. It was spellbinding to suddenly watch that entire country form, complete with its own history the moment I learned of it. You're welcome Canada, I look forward to not telling my kids about you so they can never hear of Canada. Thus condemning it into neverdom once again. Sorry, eh. 

 

back to the subject. It Happens here during flu season. Wife-y was in the hospital years back before we married, and they had max capacity, she got to be in the hallway (ran outta room, max) with the other sickies for a while. flu season. its a little like the mall at Christmas. that parking lot is empty about 340 days of the year. but those 25 days or so... look out. 

 

look guys I'm not going to weigh in overly so, we've been at this nearly a year now, unless you have the memory of a gold fish you've seen "experts" and highly educated people make guesses and assessments of various quality and accuracy (sometimes zero accuracy), even enjoyed watching them do full 180s. its the 1 year anniversary of February 2020s "don't worry" --go have yourself a chuckle and internet search back to February of 2020 and read things from the time-- You'll have a laugh.  I don't know how it is in the rest of the world but in the US the "science" has been heavily politized. some high profile politicians here have openly questioned whether the CDC can even be trusted. (and no, not the orange guy) a rather high profile guy in New York just got caught hiding thousands of deaths in fact (don't worry dear reader, it was surely a one time thing, they would never cover up such a horrific thing for political expediency... not again, anyway) 

 

This is an emergency vaccine without the normal tests and protocols. Anywho, experts no matter how good can't tell the future. 

 

120820_chuck_yeager_web.jpg

 

 

like Chuck, you are a test pilot. 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 2/12/2021 at 8:24 AM, GW8345 said:

Wow, I see the concept of individual freedom is an unknown thing to some.

 

Maybe they should educate themselves on that concept and respect other's opinions/actions, even if they don't agree with them. Calling them selfish, arrogant and ignorant isn't very tolerating and only goes to show how self-centered and primitive they are.

 

If someone doesn't want to get the vaccine that is their choice and will not affect you at all, besides, the vaccine is not 100% effective so who knows, you can get the vaccine and still get the virus.

 

It amazes me that people call a veteran who put his life on the line for 20+ years in the defense of his county selfish. There is nothing more unselfish than being willing to lay down your life for your country and yet, someone who has never meet him, who is thousands of miles away from him and probably has never worn the uniform of his country can call a veteran selfish, unbelievable.

 

If this post gets me banned then so be it but what I said had to be said and I have no regrets in saying it.

 

 

Outstanding post. I don't vaccinate. Haven't had a flu shot since leaving the military many years ago and have not had the flu. There are 7 strains of covid that they have never been able to come up with a vaccine for, yet this one is miraculously created in a few months. Haven't put a mask on and won't, considering 85% of those testing positive are regular mask wearers. I enjoy my individual freedom, if others prefer to be sheep that is their choice too. I guess it's from childhood and being told by Mom, if all your friends were jumping off a cliff, would you jump too? The answer is No.

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1 hour ago, Showme said:

Outstanding post. I don't vaccinate. Haven't had a flu shot since leaving the military many years ago and have not had the flu. There are 7 strains of covid that they have never been able to come up with a vaccine for, yet this one is miraculously created in a few months. Haven't put a mask on and won't, considering 85% of those testing positive are regular mask wearers. I enjoy my individual freedom, if others prefer to be sheep that is their choice too. I guess it's from childhood and being told by Mom, if all your friends were jumping off a cliff, would you jump too? The answer is No.

 

Wrong, FOX reports 85%, CDC reports 70%.
 

Masks definitely work when properly utilized. I work in an infectious environment and I haven’t become sick.

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11 hours ago, TaiidanTomcat said:

 

 

to be fair do you expect the hospital to call up the news to tell them their morgue is overflowing every flu season? Hospitals don't exactly brag about bad things. This is the limitation of our anecdotal knowledge. think about how many millions of things take place daily and go completely unheard by the all seeing, all knowing individual, in this case yourself. One could positively conclude that if you have not "heard it". Then surely it does not exist. I had never heard of Canada for years of my early life as well. but it was there ... just existing without my knowledge, which takes some real nerve. It was spellbinding to suddenly watch that entire country form, complete with its own history the moment I learned of it. You're welcome Canada, I look forward to not telling my kids about you so they can never hear of Canada. Thus condemning it into neverdom once again. Sorry, eh. 

 

back to the subject. It Happens here during flu season. Wife-y was in the hospital years back before we married, and they had max capacity, she got to be in the hallway (ran outta room, max) with the other sickies for a while. flu season. its a little like the mall at Christmas. that parking lot is empty about 340 days of the year. but those 25 days or so... look out. 

 

look guys I'm not going to weigh in overly so, we've been at this nearly a year now, unless you have the memory of a gold fish you've seen "experts" and highly educated people make guesses and assessments of various quality and accuracy (sometimes zero accuracy), even enjoyed watching them do full 180s. its the 1 year anniversary of February 2020s "don't worry" --go have yourself a chuckle and internet search back to February of 2020 and read things from the time-- You'll have a laugh.  I don't know how it is in the rest of the world but in the US the "science" has been heavily politized. some high profile politicians here have openly questioned whether the CDC can even be trusted. (and no, not the orange guy) a rather high profile guy in New York just got caught hiding thousands of deaths in fact (don't worry dear reader, it was surely a one time thing, they would never cover up such a horrific thing for political expediency... not again, anyway) 

 

This is an emergency vaccine without the normal tests and protocols. Anywho, experts no matter how good can't tell the future. 

 

120820_chuck_yeager_web.jpg

 

 

like Chuck, you are a test pilot. 

 

 

 

 

 


What a misguided post.

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11 hours ago, TaiidanTomcat said:

<...> It Happens here during flu season. Wife-y was in the hospital years back before we married, and they had max capacity, she got to be in the hallway (ran outta room, max) with the other sickies for a while. <...>

 Out in the hallway, but still treated - one thing. Not even space in the hallway and triaged (i.e. we continue treating patient A and let patient B die because A has marginally better chances of survival and we can only treat one) - quite another. So much for the limits of one's anecdotal knowledge.

 

11 hours ago, TaiidanTomcat said:

<...> This is an emergency vaccine without the normal tests and protocols. 

 

This is not true. Tests and protocols were adhered to. It didn't take as long as things usually do because some tests were done in parallel. Steps that delay the fielding of new vaccines

If anything, the fielding of Covid vaccines show what can be done if funding isn't a problem and if short-term profitability isn't the primary concern.

 

 

1 hour ago, Showme said:

<...> I guess it's from childhood and being told by Mom, if all your friends were jumping off a cliff, would you jump too? The answer is No.

 

I love this example. Because it shows how totally flawed some so-called "common sense logic" actually is. Because it totally misses context. Why do my friends jump off the cliff? What happens to those that stay on the cliff? Will everything work out for them all right?

I consider my friends to be good people. If they all jump off the cliff, they will have a very good reason.

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2 hours ago, Showme said:

Outstanding post. I don't vaccinate. Haven't had a flu shot since leaving the military many years ago and have not had the flu. There are 7 strains of covid that they have never been able to come up with a vaccine for, yet this one is miraculously created in a few months. Haven't put a mask on and won't, considering 85% of those testing positive are regular mask wearers. I enjoy my individual freedom, if others prefer to be sheep that is their choice too. I guess it's from childhood and being told by Mom, if all your friends were jumping off a cliff, would you jump too? The answer is No.

 

Please post your location so I can stay the hhelll away from you.

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20 hours ago, TaiidanTomcat said:

 

 

to be fair do you expect the hospital to call up the news to tell them their morgue is overflowing every flu season? Hospitals don't exactly brag about bad things. This is the limitation of our anecdotal knowledge. think about how many millions of things take place daily and go completely unheard by the all seeing, all knowing individual, in this case yourself. One could positively conclude that if you have not "heard it". Then surely it does not exist. I had never heard of Canada for years of my early life as well. but it was there ... just existing without my knowledge, which takes some real nerve. It was spellbinding to suddenly watch that entire country form, complete with its own history the moment I learned of it. You're welcome Canada, I look forward to not telling my kids about you so they can never hear of Canada. Thus condemning it into neverdom once again. Sorry, eh. 

 

back to the subject. It Happens here during flu season. Wife-y was in the hospital years back before we married, and they had max capacity, she got to be in the hallway (ran outta room, max) with the other sickies for a while. flu season. its a little like the mall at Christmas. that parking lot is empty about 340 days of the year. but those 25 days or so... look out. 

 

look guys I'm not going to weigh in overly so, we've been at this nearly a year now, unless you have the memory of a gold fish you've seen "experts" and highly educated people make guesses and assessments of various quality and accuracy (sometimes zero accuracy), even enjoyed watching them do full 180s. its the 1 year anniversary of February 2020s "don't worry" --go have yourself a chuckle and internet search back to February of 2020 and read things from the time-- You'll have a laugh.  I don't know how it is in the rest of the world but in the US the "science" has been heavily politized. some high profile politicians here have openly questioned whether the CDC can even be trusted. (and no, not the orange guy) a rather high profile guy in New York just got caught hiding thousands of deaths in fact (don't worry dear reader, it was surely a one time thing, they would never cover up such a horrific thing for political expediency... not again, anyway) 

 

This is an emergency vaccine without the normal tests and protocols. Anywho, experts no matter how good can't tell the future. 

 

 

 

 

like Chuck, you are a test pilot. 

 

 

 

 

 

With regards to news organizations, yes I do expect them to publish stories if hospitals are having such problems.  I did a search and found a number of articles about hospitals being inundated with flu patients in 2018.  Though, in my brief scan of the articles, I did not read anything of morgues being filled such that refrigeration trucks were needed.

 

I would expect any reputable news organization to publish stories that are in the public interest to know the truth.  Such as what is happening with Cuomo; whom I believe the news should be asking him some tough questions.

 

Back to my original post you quoted, I was asking why he believes the flu is more deadly than Covid-19?  I believe it's a straightforward question that doesn't require a convoluted answer.

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