R-40 ACRID Missile Question

[Brad-M]

I am looking at arming my Mig-25 Foxbat PDS with this missile. Is there a practice and operational version of this missile, or is there just the operational one? I want to paint and mark it as if the missiles were for combat.

 

Thanks

Brad

[Glynn Jacobs]

Hi Brad,

 

There are, in fact practice rounds for this missile.  You can check the internet for pictures of them, they are gray and have black and white stripes painted prominently on them.

 

The active rounds are painted a light-to-medium gray.  I don't have the info in front of me now but AKAN paints has the color listed in their "Weapons" set.

 

I am about to purchase and (eventually) build the newer 72nd ICM MiG-25PD and will probably add some ResKit missiles.  Which kit are you using?

 

HTH,

 

WARDOG

Edited October 27, 2021 by Glynn Jacobs
Corrections

[Brad-M]

Thanks Glynn. I am currently building the ICM 1/48 kit. The fit of their R-40 multi-part missiles are atrocious, and I have two that are short shot, so I am thinking of getting some AM as well. I have seen both practice rounds and the active ones now that I know what to look for, thanks to you.

 

Cheers,

Brad

[Jabba29]

Don't forget that there are both an IR and a Radar version of this missile, with usually 2 of each will be carried on an aircraft.

[Glynn Jacobs]

Yeah Jabba,

 

That is correct!

 

They tend to fire an I.R. then SARH missile at a target to maximise the kill probability.  The Infra-Red missile is fired first so that goes after the target and not chase after Semi-Active Radar Homing missile.

 

Sometimes though, you will see one of each type of the R-40s and 2 or 4 of the R-60 Aphid short range missiles on a twin, outer pylon.

[ijozic]

4 hours ago, Glynn Jacobs said:

They tend to fire an I.R. then SARH missile at a target to maximise the kill probability.  The Infra-Red missile is fired first so that goes after the target and not chase after Semi-Active Radar Homing missile.

 

That doesn't make much sense as the radar lock range is much longer than the IR lock range, especially in the front hemisphere. Depending on a scenario, I would argue the radar missile would be fired first to put the target on defensive and then engage them with the IR missile from the rear hemisphere.

 

Since the MiG-25 was developed primarily as a bomber interceptor, the main role of the IR version was against bombers when their powerful ECM gear was preventing a radar lock, AFAIK.

Edited October 28, 2021 by ijozic

[11bee]

13 hours ago, ijozic said:

 

That doesn't make much sense as the radar lock range is much longer than the IR lock range, especially in the front hemisphere. Depending on a scenario, I would argue the radar missile would be fired first to put the target on defensive and then engage them with the IR missile from the rear hemisphere.

Plus I would imagine the rocket motor would burn out quite quickly, so there should be no interference with the IR missile’s targeting.   

[Glynn Jacobs]

Hi Gents,

 

Just going by what I was told in the Navy back in 83' AND what I see written on most sites relating to the type.  Having no personal experience of having R-40s shot at me, I can't say it is the Gospel.

 

If you look at the R-40, the size of it most likely means the motor will not shut off too soon since its made for long range.  The I.R. and S.A.R.H. missiles are approximately the same size so one could infer the approximate range for both.

 

As far as the missile being DEVELOPED as a bomber interceptor, that is correct but it was never used as the B-70 was cancelled and the U.S. never invaded the U.S.S.R. with bombers.

 

As time went on, the need to adapt the missile and it's tactics against smaller targets was more realistic since the missiles reportedly did not maneuver well in the terminal phase.

 

I am open to info,

 

WARDOG

[Brad-M]

If they are the same speed, running out of fuel shouldn't be a problem should it?

[Brad-M]

I ordered 2 sets of ResKit R-40's, but they only make the one version. If I want to include both, I am going to have to figure something out.

 

Thanks All

 

Brad

[ijozic]

Plus model makes the R-40RD (I presume that you have ResKit R-40TD sets).

[ijozic]

On 10/29/2021 at 4:24 AM, Glynn Jacobs said:

Just going by what I was told in the Navy back in 83' AND what I see written on most sites relating to the type.  Having no personal experience of having R-40s shot at me, I can't say it is the Gospel.

 

As time went on, the need to adapt the missile and it's tactics against smaller targets was more realistic since the missiles reportedly did not maneuver well in the terminal phase.

 

I see that mentioned occasionally, but I get the impression it was simply a plausible theory during Cold War to explain why the Soviets developed IR versions of their SARH missiles, while in reality the initial reason was more likely to give them a chance of engaging bombers when their relatively inferior radar sets got jammed.

 

Case in point, some pages from a MiG-23ML weapons manual addendum for the R-24 missile was translated and posted recently here. Notably, it makes no mention of firing different variants of R-24 missiles to increase PK, even suggests that firing two of the same kind in quick succession doesn't increase PK that much compared to a single missile, while it could cause problems for the engine. It does suggest that when firing the IR variant, a few more seconds should be added to the waiting interval (4-6 seconds instead of 3-4 seconds between launches) to be sure the seeker doesn't lock on the earlier missile.

Edited October 30, 2021 by ijozic