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Hmmmm, Meng 1/48 F-4G?


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3 hours ago, serendip said:

Thanks Dave,

I'll check that out.

 

Curious as to the particulars of why you're sticking to Z-M; the misslies on the Meng do appeal.

Marc.

 

 

 

The details on the Meng kit just aren't as crisp and it looks toy-ish to me. Now, before anyone comments, this is my personal opinion and while yours may differ, it isn't going to change mine. The panel lines are a bit heavy as well. 

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4 hours ago, Dave Williams said:

Is the belly strap a stick on part on the Meng kit?  It’s not molded on the wing underside.

I turned up the contrast on a washed out photo posted here of the wing bottom that shows the lack of the strap Dave mentions:

 

VavFJkG.jpg

 

Good sprue shots are at the same location.

 

Last year I made some thin belly straps using using my Silhouette cutter for a friend doing an outstanding build on Large Scale Planes. While gathering references, including "scale" drawings from multiple sources like this, I found that those references didn't quite match available after-market sets in various scales (Nautilus, Hypersonic, GTR, Flying Leatherneck, and ScalePhantomPhixer), nor photos like those in the excellent DACO book ... nor with Mr. Google in general.  :blush: I also scaled up scans from the 1/72 Airfix Brit Phantom as well as the 1/48 Zukei Mura F-4S for comparison. The most useful drawings were those posted from Navy F-4 Phantom Tech Manuals as shown here.

 

What I found is that the straps, in whatever scale, needed to be tailored to a specific kit since the panel lines differed  ...  in all kits to some extent. All to say is that, like Dave, I'm anxious to see how Meng handled the straps ... if they did, that is. 

 

There are more good discussions on LSP concerning the straps here and here, as well as  an outstanding build from a modeler named Chuck from 2013.

 

So an interesting question arises - were the F-4G straps, as well as the reinforcements around the speed brakes and wing fold hinges, the same across all services, countries, and F-4 models that used them? Of course, that's for another thread.

 

Gene K

 

 

Edited by GeneK
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29 minutes ago, Dave Roof said:

 

The details on the Meng kit just aren't as crisp and it looks toy-ish to me. Now, before anyone comments, this is my personal opinion and while yours may differ, it isn't going to change mine. The panel lines are a bit heavy as well. 

Thanks for the feedback Dave and indeed I try to withhold from an opinion until I have something to base it on which I do not right now because I have neither kit. Y+Therefore your feedback is much appreciated.

 

Thanks,

 

Marc.

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Meng have modelled the ab initio slatted wing with the thicker lower torque box skin and its noticeable lip or step along its rear edge. 

A vinyl strap should fix things satisfactorily if it's not included in the kit's etched metal fret. 

 

Sorry, but the almost parallel canopy profile of the Z-M is utterly horrible. Crisp detail isn't going to fix that, ever. 

The Meng is looking a whole lot more like an F-4G and the Standard ARM is particularly cool. Shame there are no Shrikes or ALQ-184, but those are available elsewhere.

 

Tony

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, GeneK said:

I turned up the contrast on a washed out photo posted here of the wing bottom that shows the lack of the strap Dave mentions:

 

VavFJkG.jpg

 

Good sprue shots are at the same location.

 

Last year I made some thin belly straps using using my Silhouette cutter for a friend doing an outstanding build on Large Scale Planes. While gathering references, including "scale" drawings from multiple sources like this, I found that those references didn't quite match available after-market sets in various scales (Nautilus, Hypersonic, GTR, Flying Leatherneck, and ScalePhantomPhixer), nor photos like those in the excellent DACO book ... nor with Mr. Google in general.  :blush: I also scaled up scans from the 1/72 Airfix Brit Phantom as well as the 1/48 Zukei Mura F-4S for comparison. The most useful drawings were those posted from Navy F-4 Phantom Tech Manuals as shown here.

 

What I found is that the straps, in whatever scale, needed to be tailored to a specific kit since the panel lines differed  ...  in all kits to some extent. All to say is that, like Dave, I'm anxious to see how Meng handled the straps ... if they did, that is. 

 

There are more good discussions on LSP concerning the straps here and here, as well as  an outstanding build from a modeler named Chuck from 2013.

 

So an interesting question arises - were the F-4G straps, as well as the reinforcements around the speed brakes and wing fold hinges, the same across all services, countries, and F-4 models that used them? Of course, that's for another thread.

 

Gene K

 

 


Meng appear to have depicted USN style belly access panels, appropriate for F-4B and J.
 

USAF Phantoms differed in this area, owing mostly to alternative engine start design features. 

In fairness, other manufacturers have done the same: for example, the Zoukei-Mura F-4C and D kits; where they simply copied the features of their original F-4J release.
 

To ZM’s credit though, they corrected this error on their new F-4E/G kits.

 

Edited by RichB63
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Like Dave, I find Meng's surface details to be underwhelming unfortunately. My first impression of their molding was with their 1/72 F-102. Since then I have seen their F-18E/F, EA-18G and now this. In all cases, the panel lines are wider and deeper than what my eyes want to see. Also, there is a general lack of rivet/fastener details even though there is some attempt at including these here and there. Both in Meng F-18 and F-4G, the pylons and flight surfaces are very similar in that respect - quite bare - to the point that I get a die-cast vibe at times. 

 

ZM is much better in the surface detail and finesse department.

 

I don't mind an absence of rivets too much (as those can be added) but the deep and wide panel lines and a general impression of 'featureless' skin... Not sure I am feeling this one.

 

I got Meng's EA-18G though, so can't say I'll never build one.

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Is that Shigeo Koike boxart? 

Edit:if yes- seems fitting,considering how many he has drawn over the years.

That first JASDF drawing he did for Hasegawa entered popular culture,saw it reproduced as wall poster...

Edited by Petarvu
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4 hours ago, Petarvu said:

Is that Shigeo Koike boxart? 

Edit:if yes- seems fitting,considering how many he has drawn over the years.

That first JASDF drawing he did for Hasegawa entered popular culture,saw it reproduced as wall poster...

 Certainly looks like his work.

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On 11/21/2022 at 7:27 AM, GeneK said:

 

Last year I made some thin belly straps using using my Silhouette cutter for a friend doing an outstanding build on Large Scale Planes.

 

 

 

Off topic, but out of interest, what other details have you made with your cutter? I have a silhouette cutter and am just coming to terms with the things you can actually make with it. I recently made some reinforcing plates for my 1/32 Hawk 127 and wondered what else I could make (besides paint masks).

 

Also interested to hear your process, designing things can take a heck of a lot of time. Even making paint masks for a 1/48 Hurricane would take ages.

Edited by Alternative 4
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On 11/20/2022 at 5:30 PM, RichB63 said:


Meng appear to have depicted USN style belly access panels, appropriate for F-4B and J.
 

USAF Phantoms differed in this area, owing mostly to alternative engine start design features. 

Yes, good point, but I think that the area you're referencing has nothing to do with the belly straps which were being discussed.:salute:

 

Gene K

Edited by GeneK
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8 hours ago, GeneK said:

Yes, good point, but I think that the area you're referencing has nothing to do with the belly straps which were being discussed.:salute:

 

Gene K


Haha…Hey at least I was in the right neighborhood! 
 

Now that Meng have announced an Echo model to follow, the strapless wing might be a concession to accommodate “ab initio” thick-skinned versions. Easier to add a strap vs. removing one. Or maybe Meng will include a vinyl G-strap (how’s that for a visual?!) for the Wild Weasel boxing...We’ll find out soon enough.

 

 

 

Edited by RichB63
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On 11/21/2022 at 3:00 AM, Janissary said:

Like Dave, I find Meng's surface details to be underwhelming unfortunately. My first impression of their molding was with their 1/72 F-102. Since then I have seen their F-18E/F, EA-18G and now this. In all cases, the panel lines are wider and deeper than what my eyes want to see. Also, there is a general lack of rivet/fastener details even though there is some attempt at including these here and there. Both in Meng F-18 and F-4G, the pylons and flight surfaces are very similar in that respect - quite bare - to the point that I get a die-cast vibe at times. ZM is much better in the surface detail and finesse department.

 

The detail does look kind of rough at places (e.g. panel lines look similar to AMK ones), but on the other hand they are going for a cheaper price than ZM or Tamiya (e.g. 50ish USD vs 80ish).

 

Academy has incomparably better panel lines IIRC, but is overengineered IMHO while skimping on detail in some areas (some cockpit sides, wheel bays, etc.). They also never released E/G variants for whatever reason.

Edited by ijozic
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3 hours ago, ijozic said:

 

The detail does look kind of rough at places (e.g. panel lines look similar to AMK ones), but on the other hand they are going for a cheaper price than ZM or Tamiya (e.g. 50ish USD vs 80ish).

 

Academy has incomparably better panel lines IIRC, but is overengineered IMHO while skimping on detail in some areas (some cockpit sides, wheel bays, etc.). They also never released E/G variants for whatever reason.


May be different outside of the US, but over here, the Meng F-4G kit costs more than the ZM kit.  ZM is $79, while Squadron is taking preorders for the Meng kit at $100.  The only thing I don’t particularly care for on the Meng kit is that the slats are only made to be built extended, which is rare on the ground.  It sounds like Meng gives you the option.

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4 minutes ago, Dave Williams said:


The only thing I don’t particularly care for on the Meng kit is that the slats are only made to be built extended, which is rare on the ground.

You mean the Zoukei-Mura kit has the extended slats only option.

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On 11/30/2022 at 2:21 PM, Dave Williams said:


May be different outside of the US, but over here, the Meng F-4G kit costs more than the ZM kit.  ZM is $79, while Squadron is taking preorders for the Meng kit at $100.  The only thing I don’t particularly care for on the Meng kit is that the slats are only made to be built extended, which is rare on the ground.  It sounds like Meng gives you the option.

 

I was using LM as a quick reference where the Meng kit goes for 50+, but I can't seem to find ZM kits there ATM to compare.

Edited by ijozic
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On 11/30/2022 at 6:49 PM, serendip said:

Weapons and decal options on the Meng are very tempting however. Might splurg and get both just for that.

Any non-Meng provided pictures of the Meng around anyone?

 

Thanks,

Marc.

We should start to get some soon, they are landing or have just about landed in the UK, so Im guessing USA buyers will get getting their mits on then now too.

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Looks like the instructions are up.

 

https://www.scalemates.com/products/img/9/6/8/1440968-46-instructions.pdf

 

Is there no cockpit sidewall detail?  The instructions don’t show any sidewall parts and the drawing showing the tub inserted into the fuselage suggests there’s nothing molded to the inside of the fuselage.  Also, I don’t think that open bay in the left side of the nose is a detail that anyone asked for or really wanted.  I do like that the kit has more weapons options that the ZM kit, as well as having retracted slats, but the kit lacking the belly strap may be a dealbreaker for me.

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