Delanie Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 The hull (yes i know what its really called but seems more appropriate for a 'blended' design) seems deeper than the B2 I got the impression from the article above that It's smaller than the B2 or did i read that wrong? I do like the look of the air intakes but can't help thinking they could be a problem at low speed, maybe relief scoops under the body? I'm intrigued with the idea not having the b2's 'serrated' trailing edge and control surfaces. One major concern I have with modern thinking though is the idea of remotely controlled aircraft I know we have the 'drones' but I can't help but think the lack of real time feedback to a pilot could be a problem apart from that it's taking the reality away from fighting, almost like a video game or the paper version of 'battleships' when the number of lives destroyed is literally numbers on paper. What's the B52 j/k (or am I missing the joke?) I can't help but think of the Dale Brown books with the composite winged B52 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ST0RM Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 I saw some A-12 Avenger lineage, with the deep fuselage. At least to my eye. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Delanie Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 Just a thought haven't there been a spate of UFO sightings recently? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Geoff M Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 2 hours ago, Delanie said: What's the B52 j/k (or am I missing the joke?) I can't help but think of the Dale Brown books with the composite winged B52 The B-52 is starting a upgrade program to replace engines, radar and other things. Read about it here Geoff M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Delanie Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 Thanks Geoff, I can't believe that these are the same air frames as rolled off the line in the 70's. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fasteagle12 Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Delanie said: Thanks Geoff, I can't believe that these are the same air frames as rolled off the line in the 70's. I think the last B-52 rolled off the line in 1962, not the 70's.. https://www.thisdayinaviation.com/26-october-1962-2/ Edited December 3, 2022 by fasteagle12 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sigtau Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 (edited) 7 hours ago, Delanie said: The hull (yes i know what its really called but seems more appropriate for a 'blended' design) seems deeper than the B2 I got the impression from the article above that It's smaller than the B2 or did i read that wrong? I do like the look of the air intakes but can't help thinking they could be a problem at low speed, maybe relief scoops under the body? I'm intrigued with the idea not having the b2's 'serrated' trailing edge and control surfaces. One major concern I have with modern thinking though is the idea of remotely controlled aircraft I know we have the 'drones' but I can't help but think the lack of real time feedback to a pilot could be a problem apart from that it's taking the reality away from fighting, almost like a video game or the paper version of 'battleships' when the number of lives destroyed is literally numbers on paper. What's the B52 j/k (or am I missing the joke?) I can't help but think of the Dale Brown books with the composite winged B52 The saw toothed pattern on the B-2 was done to improve low level penetration capability. The USAF wasn't convinced the B-2 would be stealthy enough for high level penetration, so they wanted to ensure it could still fly low level profiles. The B-21 only has a payload of 30K lbs, half of what the B-2 can carry. Notice the main gear only have two wheels each. Gross weight will probably top out around 200 - 220K lbs, making it a medium bomber. Cockpit is VERY narrow compared to the B-2, looks to be single seated or perhaps tandem like the B-47 and B-58. Likely only twin engined, using engines derived from the F-35 program. I'm not sure if anyone else noticed, but during the live stream, they kept cutting over to views of two aircraft, the F-14 and X-47B. There is supposed to be a parallel development program of a next generation long range penetration fighter "Penetrating Counter-Air" (PCA), which would be an escort for the B-21. Perhaps there's more news coming on the PCA/NGAD projects? Edited December 3, 2022 by sigtau Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hemspilot Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 8 hours ago, Delanie said: The hull (yes i know what its really called but seems more appropriate for a 'blended' design) seems deeper than the B2 I got the impression from the article above that It's smaller than the B2 or did i read that wrong? I do like the look of the air intakes but can't help thinking they could be a problem at low speed, maybe relief scoops under the body? I'm intrigued with the idea not having the b2's 'serrated' trailing edge and control surfaces. One major concern I have with modern thinking though is the idea of remotely controlled aircraft I know we have the 'drones' but I can't help but think the lack of real time feedback to a pilot could be a problem apart from that it's taking the reality away from fighting, almost like a video game or the paper version of 'battleships' when the number of lives destroyed is literally numbers on paper. What's the B52 j/k (or am I missing the joke?) I can't help but think of the Dale Brown books with the composite winged B52 The B-21 has always been designed smaller than the B-2 or the other strategic bombers. The re-engining of the B-52 has been (at least temporarily shelved). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
southwestforests Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 Primary impact the rollout event had on me was leading me to consciously think, "given there is no model kit having interior detail (and the pilots) developed and marketed by Renwal and Aviation Leak & Space Technology magazine, there is no reason to be excited about either the rollout event or the airplane, can't put that excitement energy in to actually DOING something with it." And led to me thinking, whoa, that's rather more cynical than expected, where'd that come from? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Geoff M Posted December 4, 2022 Share Posted December 4, 2022 9 hours ago, hemspilot said: The re-engining of the B-52 has been (at least temporarily shelved). Had not heard that. My December issue of Air Force magazine showed the final configuration in an artist's impression and it had the new engines on it. Geoff M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Da SWO Posted December 4, 2022 Share Posted December 4, 2022 22 hours ago, hemspilot said: The B-21 has always been designed smaller than the B-2 or the other strategic bombers. The re-engining of the B-52 has been (at least temporarily shelved). Is the electronics upgrade still a go? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lockheed2004 Posted December 4, 2022 Share Posted December 4, 2022 On 12/3/2022 at 3:44 PM, hemspilot said: The B-21 has always been designed smaller than the B-2 or the other strategic bombers. The re-engining of the B-52 has been (at least temporarily shelved). Source for this B-52 snippet? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spruemeister Posted December 4, 2022 Share Posted December 4, 2022 I’m sure there’s a more than adequate reason for it, but that wide frame down the center of the see outside parts bugs me. Rick “non stealth pilot” L. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fasteagle12 Posted December 4, 2022 Share Posted December 4, 2022 2 hours ago, lockheed2004 said: Source for this B-52 snippet? I was wondering that myself. I haven't seen anything on it. The first planes to have new engines installed was planned to be still over a year away. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
southwestforests Posted December 5, 2022 Share Posted December 5, 2022 9 minutes ago, fasteagle12 said: I haven't seen anything on it. The first planes to have new engines installed was planned to be still over a year away. The stuff I'm finding at the moment doesn't mention a program halt or delay. Samples: August 26, 2022, https://breakingdefense.com/2022/08/with-new-radar-and-engines-in-sight-the-b-52-gets-ready-for-largest-modification-in-its-history/ Quote Currently, the Air Force anticipates outfitting the first B-52s with new engines in the 2026-2027 timeframe, with initial operational capability occurring in 2030. The service is still working out exactly how the Oklahoma City Air Logistics Complex at Tinker Air Force Base will juggle both the radar and engine replacement modifications, as the new radar will be ready to be installed before the new engines. “The first jets that will come out of that [radar] mod line will most likely have radar only, and then at some point, probably at their next depot timeline, [they will] come back to get the engine replacement,” he said. However, once both the engine and radar replacement programs are in full swing, B-52s will likely receive both technologies during the same depot period. September 25, 2022, https://theaviationist.com/2022/09/25/b-52-new-engine-nacelles-test/ Quote The two modifications, however, are not expected to happen at the same time, at least in the beginning. “The first jets that will come out of that [radar] mod line will most likely have radar only, and then at some point, probably at their next depot timeline, [they will] come back to get the engine replacement,” said Col. Ruscetta. It is possible that the B-52 will get two redesignations as the modifications move forward, becoming the B-52J or possibly B-52K. The last redesignation was in 1961 when, with the installation of the TF33 engines, the designation changed from B-52G to the current B-52H. The two redesignations might be required as the B-52 pilot operating manual and maintenance manuals will need to be re-written because of the new radar and again when the engines are replaced. October 27, 2022, https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/32507-boeing-selects-apu-b-52-bomber-modernization Quote Boeing selected a new auxiliary power unit (APU) manufactured by Honeywell to upgrade the B-52 strategic bomber. Honeywell announced on October 27, 2022, that its GTCP 36-150 APUs would be integrated into the Auxiliary Starter Air Unit (ASAU) of the aircraft to start the jet engines before departure. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Geoff M Posted December 5, 2022 Share Posted December 5, 2022 4 hours ago, Da SWO said: Is the electronics upgrade still a go? The article stated the Buff would get the AESA radar similar to what is in the F-18E/F and take the place of the EVS system so it is removed. Geoff M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
habu2 Posted December 5, 2022 Share Posted December 5, 2022 Boeing trailered an airframe from the Boneyard to OKC to use as an integration test frame. Raytheon and Rolls Royce are supplying the radar and engines respectively, and Boeing is responsible for the fit and integration. They won't mod a flyable airframe until the integration task is done, and that's probably 2-3 years away (WAG). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KursadA Posted December 5, 2022 Author Share Posted December 5, 2022 (edited) As far as I know there is no delay - with so many fits and starts, it is easy to get confused about its latest status. Air Force magazine did a fairly comprehensive article a few months back, as far as I know the program is making rapid progress. Edited December 5, 2022 by KursadA Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lockheed2004 Posted December 5, 2022 Share Posted December 5, 2022 As someone involved on the RR side, supporting the initial batch of engine deliveries, I’m also quite unaware of a delay to the program. Thus my question 😉 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted December 5, 2022 Share Posted December 5, 2022 On 12/3/2022 at 3:44 PM, hemspilot said: The B-21 has always been designed smaller than the B-2 or the other strategic bombers. The re-engining of the B-52 has been (at least temporarily shelved). they started building the new engines for the B52 a few months back in Indy gaty Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Charlie D. Posted December 5, 2022 Share Posted December 5, 2022 21 hours ago, fasteagle12 said: I was wondering that myself. I haven't seen anything on it. The first planes to have new engines installed was planned to be still over a year away. Someone tweeted a screen cap of a supposed “official memo” saying it wasn’t going to happen. That’s how that rumor started. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ken Cartwright Posted December 7, 2022 Share Posted December 7, 2022 Back on the B-21, I thought this had some interesting insights and speculation about it: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pollie Posted December 9, 2022 Share Posted December 9, 2022 On 12/3/2022 at 8:54 PM, sigtau said: Cockpit is VERY narrow compared to the B-2, looks to be single seated or perhaps tandem like the B-47 and B-58 Looking at how they designed the cockpit glazing, this would mean no forward vision for a singleseat pilot in the middle? Good luck landing this plane 🙂 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bashace Posted December 9, 2022 Share Posted December 9, 2022 I'm pretty sure this plane will be landing itself, if there is a pilot on board, he's just along for the ride. Besides, if it doesn't have the "Look-through" technology like the F-35 I would be shocked. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Geoff M Posted December 10, 2022 Share Posted December 10, 2022 Some of the literature I have read on this is that some versions will be unmanned so self-landing of the manned version is highly likely. Geoff M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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