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C-130 A, B, E, H

#1 User is offline   Orion Field 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 03:22 AM

I plan on making lots of C-130's in the 72 scale, mostly newer models H's and J's, but for my first few, I would like to build an A, B, E, and H. I am starting with a C-130E in modern gray camo from the idaho ANG. I am using the Italeri kit with the Flight Path nacelles, but I would like to know for future reference what the main external differences between the B, E, and H models. I know the A has short nacelles, and 3 bladed props, but I really know nothing about the others. Any help would be great!

#2 User is offline   Orion Field 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 07:38 PM

Also, if anyone could suggest any reference books, that would be great as well!

#3 User is offline   Tom 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 08:02 PM

View PostOrion Field, on 27 April 2011 - 03:22 AM, said:

I plan on making lots of C-130's in the 72 scale, mostly newer models H's and J's, but for my first few, I would like to build an A, B, E, and H. I am starting with a C-130E in modern gray camo from the idaho ANG. I am using the Italeri kit with the Flight Path nacelles, but I would like to know for future reference what the main external differences between the B, E, and H models. I know the A has short nacelles, and 3 bladed props, but I really know nothing about the others. Any help would be great!


OF,

Have you seen this review of the Flightpath resin engine nacelles?

http://www.cybermode..._fp_72107.shtml

Tom

#4 User is offline   Orion Field 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 10:41 PM

I have, and its very helpful, but what other external differences are there between the B, E and H?

#5 User is offline   john53 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 12:35 AM

This is a helpful site. Got some good pics
of planes my brother maintained at Forbes.
HTH---john
http://www.herkybirds.com/

#6 User is online   Jennings 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 12:44 AM

The engine nacelles on the A are different from all others. The Italeri kit's nacelles *forward of the firewall* are correct for the A, but not the aft part attached to the wing (it's correct for later models). Doing an A is actually fairly involved. The B, E, and early H are *basically* similar except for the side cargo door, some windows, and the small wing tanks on the B.

There are gobs of little details, but the basic shape of the airframe didn't change much up thru the early H/K.

This post has been edited by Jennings: 28 April 2011 - 12:44 AM


#7 User is offline   aircommando130 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 02:20 AM

The C-130B didn't have any wingtanks...the A model had the small wingtanks outboard of the engines and the first few E models had the side door that was eliminated completely and later they added the SKE (station keeping equipment) dome on top the forward fuselage. It was used for formation flying to keep everybody clear of each other. :thumbsup:

#8 User is offline   Orion Field 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 03:04 AM

All of the photos I've looked at of the E show look like they have cables leading from the fuselage to the tail, those cables don't seem to be there on the H models, is that right?

#9 User is offline   Modeler7 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 03:27 AM

Fraid you are wrong...kinda.

It gets complicated like most things when you are talking about a legacy aircraft like the C-130 with so many mods and de-mods.

I will just talk about the "H" model.

The H is a C-130E with -15 engines. (T-56A-15 has the first two stages of the turbine cooled, relative term, so they can run hotter which equals more power. There are a few other little differences but it is transparent to the model builder. And has the HF antenna wires.

The C-130H-1 has the HF antenna you are talking about (the two long wires) and an Aux Power Unit on the left side with a different shape air intake along with different shape air intakes for the air conditioner/pressurization system on the right side.

The C-130H-2 or 2.5 has upgraded avionics and a few bleed air differences but no HF antennas and the same APU and AC/Press systems.

The C-130H-3 has a different electrical system and avionics system and no HF antenna and the same APU and AC/Press systems. A very simple way of identifying. I think and I could be very wrong with this statement but I believe all the H-3's have LIRCM pods on the rear of the fuselage and might have ALR-69 systems. But like I said, I could be wrong. All of them have SKE domes on the top and bottom.

A google search w/ pictures has about all the info you need. I could go on and on.

#10 User is offline   Orion Field 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 03:30 AM

Thanks, thats very helpful!

#11 User is offline   Scott Hemsley 

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Posted 02 May 2011 - 08:38 PM

In a somewhat related question, namely C-130E/H engines. The 1/72 Flightpath resin engines go for almost 12 Pounds Sterling. Heritage Aviation has 4x 1/72 C-130 engines (RAF fit) for half that price.

http://www.heritagea...&product_id=126


Two questions.

One: Anyone have a review of the Heritage Aviation engines (advertised as a replacement for the 1/72 Airfix/Italeri/Testors C-130) and any idea why the price difference between them and Flightpath?

Two: What do they mean by "RAF fit"?

Scott

#12 User is offline   Andre 

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Posted 03 May 2011 - 09:45 AM

View PostScott Hemsley, on 02 May 2011 - 08:38 PM, said:

Two: What do they mean by "RAF fit"?

Most likely, the British Hercules variants have small differences compared to other C-130's.

Cheers,

Andre

#13 User is offline   Koen L 

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Posted 03 May 2011 - 10:20 AM

Think he just wants to point out they can be used for a RAF Hercules. On the Heritage site it does say the engines are for the Airfix kit btw. C-130 engines

This post has been edited by Koen L: 03 May 2011 - 10:21 AM


#14 User is offline   Flyboyf18 

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Posted 03 May 2011 - 12:27 PM

Just a quick point ref the engines;
When Italeri engineered their kit they made the engine mounting stubs the same length. Since the out board engines are past the wing taper they are further rearward than the inboards. If you check pics (try Airliners.net) and plans (good ones) you will see that the props are all in line, therefore you will need to add a plug to the out board engine mount to bring that prop in line with the inboards.
I found a couple of good pics on Airliners of Herc side views at the engines that show this clearly.
HTH

#15 User is offline   Scott Hemsley 

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Posted 04 May 2011 - 01:34 AM

View PostKoen L, on 03 May 2011 - 10:20 AM, said:

Think he just wants to point out they can be used for a RAF Hercules. On the Heritage site it does say the engines are for the Airfix kit btw. C-130 engines


Thanks for the reply. I think I can see a set arriving on my workbench in the not-to-distant future. :thumbsup:

FWIW: The stated Airfix Hercules and the old Testors C-130E are both reboxed Italeri C-130E/H kits ... so they'll all work with the resin.



Scott

#16 User is offline   Scott Hemsley 

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Posted 04 May 2011 - 01:37 AM

View PostFlyboyf18, on 03 May 2011 - 12:27 PM, said:

Just a quick point ref the engines;
When Italeri engineered their kit they made the engine mounting stubs the same length. Since the out board engines are past the wing taper they are further rearward than the inboards. If you check pics (try Airliners.net) and plans (good ones) you will see that the props are all in line, therefore you will need to add a plug to the out board engine mount to bring that prop in line with the inboards.
I found a couple of good pics on Airliners of Herc side views at the engines that show this clearly.
HTH


Good point! I'll keep that in mind when I start work on my Herc. I somehow got the feeling that word of caution also applies to any resin engine offering, beit Flightpath or Heritage Aviation.


Scott

#17 User is offline   ikar 

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Posted 04 May 2011 - 02:15 AM

And just to add to it, a few variations:

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#18 User is offline   gmat 

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 12:30 AM

Here ais a list of various differences with the early C-130 models. I'll start with the C-130A. Photos are from different source. Most of the old ones are from Japanese photographers that I met at Yokota AB, some are USAF photos and a few are mine.

Start with the early C-130A.
C-130A roman (APS-42 radar) versus pinocchio nose. (APN-59 radar)
Clamshell nose gear doors versus single nose gear door. 53 and 54 year models with the roman nose had this feature. Later single door retrofitted to most but not all early C-130As.
Step versus (56 year models and earlier including retrofitted noses) faired pinocchio nose. (57 models and later)
Forward cargo and extra fuselage window.
Upper fuselage windows.( 56 year and earlier)
Lack of wing tanks or retrofitted smaller 450 gal outer wing tanks (C-130A) versus no wing tanks (C-130B) and larger 1350 gal center wing tanks. (C-130E and later models)
Single covers for GTC (C-130A) versus split flap cover for intake and open exhaust for GTC. (C-130B and later)
(C-130A ) T57-A9 engines set further into the wings with Aero Products three blade props versus (C-130B up to 71 year C-130Hs) T57A-7s set further forward with Hamilton Standard four blade Props. C-130A engine fairing extend up to the flaps (inner engines) and into the flaps. (outer engines) C-130B and later have fairings ending well before the flaps.
Two dagger fuel drains on T56A-9 engines. Single dagger drain on later T56A-7 and -15 engines.
Fuel dump drain nubs on outer wings on C-130A models only.
Short fuselage tail versus longer beaver tail. Holds a crash position indicator. Retrofitted to mainly C-130Es in the late 60s/early 70s and introduced on the production line until replaced on 74 year C-130Hs, by a small whip antenna slightly before the tail on upper fuselage. Retrofitted to earlier C-130s with the beaver tail.

Some photographs to explain the above.
The difference with the C-130A and the other models is that the first C-130A had the APS-42 radar in the short nose, also called the 'roman nose'. They also had the clamshell nose gear door. 53 and 54 year models had the roman nose. That means it is split in half and opens on each side of the nose gear, not slides to the rear like later C-130A and all of the rest of the C-130s.

Roman nose but with the later nose gear door. Slides behind the nose gear. Prototype for RC-130A program, 1375 MCS, 1370 PMW, later 1 ACGS in1968.
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JC-130A out of Hanscom AFB. Roman nose. 3245 Test Sqdn, later to 4950 TS, Wright-Patt. More of the same aircraft follows.
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You can see the clamshell nose door a bit better here. 53-3133
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Later many butt not all of the early roman nose C-130A were retrofitted with the later 'pinocchio' nose. These as well as 55 and 56 models had the later radar nose but lacked the slight fairing where the top of the radome meets the fuselage nose, leading to a noticeable step. C-130A Blind Bat.
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57 year C-130A models and all later straight C-130 had the fairing which gave the nose a curved appearance. WC-130E 54WRS.
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The C-130A, C-130B and 61 year C-130Es all had the forward cargo door and only the C-130A had an extra window. Serious accidents where the door opened in flight caused the doors to be permanently closed. C-130D. 139 TAS, NYANG.
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More later.
Best wishes,
Grant

This post has been edited by gmat: 05 May 2011 - 02:13 AM


#19 User is offline   gmat 

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 01:13 AM

Previous to the 1957 year C-130A, the C-130A had a series of windows on the upper fuselage, two before the wing and one aft. They also had an extra window above the cockpit. These were removed from the 57 year C-130A and later C-130s. Until about 59/60, the C-130As did not have the 450 gal wing tanks. 463 TCW, Dyess AFB, taken at Hickam AFB.
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Note extra window. 815 TCS, Tachikawa AB?
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57 year model, note lack of upper windows. 21st TCS, Naha AB Okinawa.
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21 TAS Naha AB. Outer wing tanks.
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C-130A Blind Bat with outer wing 450 gal fuel tanks. 374 TAW, Naha AB, Okinawa, taken at Yokota AB.
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C-130A. Single door for intake and exhaust for GTC. 815 TCS, Naha AB.
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C-130B and later. Split door for intake and open exhaust for GTC. JC-130B, 6594 TG, Hickam AFB.
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Note two dagger fuel drains under engine.
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C-130E showing engines with single fuel drain pipes.
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More to come.
Best wishes,
Grant

#20 User is offline   gmat 

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Posted 05 May 2011 - 01:41 AM

Notice two drains on outer wing. Taken at Yokota AB. From Naha or Tachikawa AB.
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Close up of pinup on above aircraft. Akemi Oba.
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Don't have a good photo showing the later flush drain holes on C-130B and later aircraft. But if if you strain your eyes, you might be able to see that there are no nub on the far wing. 815 WRS, 64- 14861, test of replacement vertical height radar replacement for APN-42. Note fairing under the fuselage. None chosen and the APN-42 remained in service.
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Short tail versus beaver tail.

JC-130B. For some reoson, the JC-130B never had the beaver tail mod.
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HC-130P 6594 TG, Hickan Hawaii. The 6594 Test Group at Hickam was unique in it did not have a squadron to fly the aircraft. The earlier 6593 TS which flew the JC-119J and initially operated the JC-130Bs was later replaced by the 6594 TG and the test squadron went on to control the land based radars to support the operation.
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More later.
Best wishes,
Grant

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