Rob_Haelterman Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) Hi guys, What would currently be the best book to teach me the evolution of the F-5E (sensor bumps, nose, LERX, etc.) ? I need to make sure that my late 80s US Navy F-5E is basically correct. TIA Rob Edited May 31, 2016 by Rob_Haelterman Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jay Chladek Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) For an F-5E of that era, your best source might be World Air Power Journal Volume 25 Summer 1996 as covers development of the entire F-5 up to that point in its cover story. While the information is 20 years old, it does go so far as talking about the full evolution of the F-5A to the F-5G (what became the F-20). It talks about what countries opted for newer ejection seats, what types, when the shark nose/LERX change was offered and some of the various rebuild options that various companies were offering at that time and every country that operated F-5s (even a post war Vietnam). Heck, it even told me who the company was that did the weather radar modifications on NASA's T-38s. That is information I have yet to find in any dedicated F-5 book. For pictures of USN F-5 Adversaries, the old Detail and Scale "Colors and Markings" book on US Navy Adversaries (which came out right after the Top Gun movie did and has some images of the movie's "MiG-28s") would likely be the best source for exterior shots. Detail and Scale's old F-5E Tiger II book is also a good source as it has Navy F-5 cockpits, showing the lack of a radar scope (just a checklist in that spot). Finding these older books might be a little tough though, but the C&M volumes don't tend to command as high a price on the secondary market like some of the D&S books can. The beauty of doing an F-5E from that era is they pretty much were plain jane jets without the lumps and bumps seen today. So in 1/72 an Italeri kit would be your best choice. In 1/48, probably the AFV "MiG-28" issue or the first Aggressor F-5E kit are your best options for the original nose and LERX. Edited May 31, 2016 by Jay Chladek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Vultures1 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Top tip about the WAPJ issue; just picked one up at a good price on Amazon. Thanks Jay! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rob_Haelterman Posted May 31, 2016 Author Share Posted May 31, 2016 For an F-5E of that era, your best source might be World Air Power Journal Volume 25 Summer 1996 as covers development of the entire F-5 up to that point in its cover story. While the information is 20 years old, it does go so far as talking about the full evolution of the F-5A to the F-5G (what became the F-20). It talks about what countries opted for newer ejection seats, what types, when the shark nose/LERX change was offered and some of the various rebuild options that various companies were offering at that time and every country that operated F-5s (even a post war Vietnam). Heck, it even told me who the company was that did the weather radar modifications on NASA's T-38s. That is information I have yet to find in any dedicated F-5 book. For pictures of USN F-5 Adversaries, the old Detail and Scale "Colors and Markings" book on US Navy Adversaries (which came out right after the Top Gun movie did and has some images of the movie's "MiG-28s") would likely be the best source for exterior shots. Detail and Scale's old F-5E Tiger II book is also a good source as it has Navy F-5 cockpits, showing the lack of a radar scope (just a checklist in that spot). Finding these older books might be a little tough though, but the C&M volumes don't tend to command as high a price on the secondary market like some of the D&S books can. The beauty of doing an F-5E from that era is they pretty much were plain jane jets without the lumps and bumps seen today. So in 1/72 an Italeri kit would be your best choice. In 1/48, probably the AFV "MiG-28" issue or the first Aggressor F-5E kit are your best options for the original nose and LERX. Thanks Jay, I have the C&M book. Good value for money, but it won't tell me which nose, LERX, etc I need to put on my bird. I hope I can find the WAPJ before other readers on this forum snap them all up ;-) Cheers Rob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
f5guy Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Thanks Jay, I have the C&M book. Good value for money, but it won't tell me which nose, LERX, etc I need to put on my bird. I hope I can find the WAPJ before other readers on this forum snap them all up ;-) Cheers Rob Which jet are you modeling Rob? I might be able to help. Fred K. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rob_Haelterman Posted May 31, 2016 Author Share Posted May 31, 2016 Which jet are you modeling Rob? I might be able to help. Fred K. Hi Fred, I was hoping to do F-5E BuNo 160795 when it was BortNr 51 with VF126. It seems it has the sharknose and large LEX. http://www.makettinfo.hu/forum/image.php?img_url=upload%2F201101%2F53_q_f-5e_160795_vf126.jpg I was hoping to use the 1/72 Hobby Boss kit, but that has the early features. I have the late Italeri kit as well, but am not sure how much I like the raised panel lines. Any suggestions welcome. Cheers Rob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jay Chladek Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Thanks Jay, I have the C&M book. Good value for money, but it won't tell me which nose, LERX, etc I need to put on my bird. I hope I can find the WAPJ before other readers on this forum snap them all up ;-) Cheers Rob Of we are talking the late 1980s though, you are likely safe in building a Navy jet with the original nose and wing. I see one picture of a VFA-127 jet from the early 90s with a shark nose in the WAPJ book, but the original wing and I'm pretty sure the nose replacements weren't really undertaken until maybe 1991 at the earliest. If it is a Top Gun based jet, it will be original nose since those were moved out starting in 1987 to make room for F-16Ns (which were retired starting in 1995 due to unanticipated stress cracks forming in the airframes). It looks like many of the other adversary units in the Navy were mostly operating leased F-21 Kfirs until 1989, re-equipping with F-5s again starting that year (or at least increasing their numbers). So I wouldn't necessarily worry unless you are building a model of a VFA-127 jet, which seemed to be the main operator of F-5s during that 1988 onward period. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rob_Haelterman Posted May 31, 2016 Author Share Posted May 31, 2016 Of we are talking the late 1980s though, you are likely safe in building a Navy jet with the original nose and wing. I see one picture of a VFA-127 jet from the early 90s with a shark nose in the WAPJ book, but the original wing and I'm pretty sure the nose replacements weren't really undertaken until maybe 1991 at the earliest. If it is a Top Gun based jet, it will be original nose since those were moved out starting in 1987 to make room for F-16Ns (which were retired starting in 1995 due to unanticipated stress cracks forming in the airframes). It looks like many of the other adversary units in the Navy were mostly operating leased F-21 Kfirs until 1989, re-equipping with F-5s again starting that year (or at least increasing their numbers). So I wouldn't necessarily worry unless you are building a model of a VFA-127 jet, which seemed to be the main operator of F-5s during that 1988 onward period. Hi Jay, I was hoping to do this bird, which ought to be from that period, but looks to have big LEX and sharknose. http://www.makettinfo.hu/forum/image.php?img_url=upload%2F201101%2F53_q_f-5e_160795_vf126.jpg It seems that a number of VF-126 F-5Es had these features. Cheers Rob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
achterkirch Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Hey Rob to help you out a bit more. If you want to use the hobby boss kit and also make it have the shark nose and larger LEX's here a resin conversion set for those on eBay. http://m.ebay.com/itm/Aztec-Decals-1-72-NORTHROP-F-5-SHARKNOSE-RESIN-CONVERSION-KIT-/361451420629?nav=SEARCH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jay Chladek Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 (edited) It has a shark nose yes, but I am pretty sure the wings are original if that is a 1980s picture because I don't recall the LERX upgrade being done by Navy aircraft until Northrop began "Tiger IV" upgrades (1993 on). The Swiss I believe were the first ones to use the LERX upgrade on their jets. Edited June 1, 2016 by Jay Chladek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rob_Haelterman Posted June 1, 2016 Author Share Posted June 1, 2016 It has a shark nose yes, but I am pretty sure the wings are original if that is a 1980s picture because I don't recall the LERX upgrade being done by Navy aircraft until Northrop began "Tiger IV" upgrades (1993 on). The Swiss I believe were the first ones to use the LERX upgrade on their jets. Thanks Jay, while I await the WAPJ, would you be able to put a date on the introduction of the sharknose in the Navy ? TIA R Quote Link to post Share on other sites
f5guy Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Hi Fred, I was hoping to do F-5E BuNo 160795 when it was BortNr 51 with VF126. It seems it has the sharknose and large LEX. http://www.makettinfo.hu/forum/image.php?img_url=upload%2F201101%2F53_q_f-5e_160795_vf126.jpg I was hoping to use the 1/72 Hobby Boss kit, but that has the early features. I have the late Italeri kit as well, but am not sure how much I like the raised panel lines. Any suggestions welcome. Cheers Rob Hi Rob, I've got a slide in my collection of the opposite side of this jet taken in Oct 1985, and it clearly shows that it has the late style wing root LEXs, and duckbill nose cone as done in the Swiss Italeri kit. It is an ex-VF-43 jet, and they, along with Topgun, started getting reworked Tigers with the late style mods in the mid 80's. HTH, Fred K. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rob_Haelterman Posted June 3, 2016 Author Share Posted June 3, 2016 Hi Rob, I've got a slide in my collection of the opposite side of this jet taken in Oct 1985, and it clearly shows that it has the late style wing root LEXs, and duckbill nose cone as done in the Swiss Italeri kit. It is an ex-VF-43 jet, and they, along with Topgun, started getting reworked Tigers with the late style mods in the mid 80's. HTH, Fred K. Thanks ! On the other hand, this means some kit-bashing. :-) Cheers R Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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