Neo Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 Hey guys ive been noticing that my Patriot wasent going good these days with irregular paint flow after cleaning it tonight i did a test and this is what im getting: Air is comming out of here (red arrow) betewwn the regulator and the tip what should i do with this ? all parts look pretty clean! should i contac Badger ? Cheers Neo Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tom-navy-cat Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 (edited) Hey guys ive been noticing that my Patriot wasent going good these days with irregular paint flow after cleaning it tonight i did a test and this is what im getting: Air is comming out of here (red arrow) betewwn the regulator and the tip what should i do with this ? all parts look pretty clean! should i contac Badger ? Cheers Neo Hi Neo, probably the air you see...has always been there, but because of a drop of water, this time you have seen it Anyway the problem cant be the crowncap (red arrow points there) because most of the time i airbrush without that cap (the small cap is only there to protect the tip of the airbrush needle) dont think this is the problem, maybe your nozzle has a small crack or a ragged edge which will give problems with the flow of your paint Some more points you can look at(is the airflow not obstructed between the nozzle and nozzle-cap,is the inside of the nozzle-cap clean? is your needle bent at the tip) Hope this will help Edited February 25, 2013 by tom-navy-cat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
scapilot Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 Yep, mine did that too. Then it got to the point where it was blowing bubbles back just from initiating air. Then there was paint getting slung from the trigger well, and that was about the time that I said "Nope", and gave it back to Badger. They didn't really ever tell me what was wrong, just sent me all new parts. It worked much better, but I still never really developed a consistent feel for that airbrush. I've heard some people swear by it, others, like myself found it too inconsistent. I've since switched to the Grex TG2 Tritium, and I'll never look back. Expensive, yes...worth it for as much as I'm invested in the hobby? Absolutely. Badger should take it back without any issues. I'd strongly suggest having a back up airbrush if you plan on doing any model building in the next 5-8 weeks though, because they're never in much of a hurry to get the stuff back to you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bob Beary Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 Put some beeswax or chapstick on the threads. Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buffalowings Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 I have the same issue with my patriot as well and have emailed badger, but it has been an entire week and they have yet to respond. Not very satisfied with badger anymore, especially since all my previous airbrushes were their's , (badger 200, 175, and the 105). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
matrixone Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 I agree with what Bob said, that should take care of it. Something I noticed the past few years is the quality of Badger has dropped, the experience that buffalowings had with his airbrush is similar to others that I know of. My older Badger 150 and 100G airbrushes are still going strong and will probably outlast the new Badger designs. As good as the 150 and 100G are I know they will wear out eventually so I bought some Iwatas as their replacements and am very pleased with them so far. Matrixone Quote Link to post Share on other sites
scapilot Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I have the same issue with my patriot as well and have emailed badger, but it has been an entire week and they have yet to respond. Not very satisfied with badger anymore, especially since all my previous airbrushes were their's , (badger 200, 175, and the 105). Like I said, I had to wait a while to hear something back about my 105 as well. It took about five weeks. In that time, I had picked up the Badger 100, and actually liked it a litle bit more, since it seemed to have finer control. I don't know, the Patriot was never consistent for me. I could be pulling off fine lines for a half hour no problem, and then I'd come back, and it was nearly impossible to repeat what I'd just done. Being that this was my very first airbrush, I was convinced that I was just not going to be able to learn to airbrush, and about gave it up. Thankfully, once I started using the 100, I was able to actually gauge my successes by having consistent results (both good and bad), but I could focus on what I needed to improve. I have kept my 100, but since I liked the Grex so much, I picked up their Genesis XN, and it came last week, and I'm about ready to just let my 100 go on ebay as well. Good as it's been, it holds no comparison to the results from the Grex line. I agree with what Bob said, that should take care of it. Something I noticed the past few years is the quality of Badger has dropped, the experience that buffalowings had with his airbrush is similar to others that I know of. My older Badger 150 and 100G airbrushes are still going strong and will probably outlast the new Badger designs. As good as the 150 and 100G are I know they will wear out eventually so I bought some Iwatas as their replacements and am very pleased with them so far. Matrixone I agree. I was on the fence between the Genesis from Grex, or the Krome. I read some good things about both, but then I started reading some not so hopeful comments about the likelihood of the Krome down the road, and I'm just not keen on parting with that kind of money for something that isn't going to last. In regards to their quality slipping of late, I honestly can't make that comparison as I've only been a customer of theirs for the past year. However, I did purchase two of their brushes in that time, and had to send one, and had to have a replacement cup sent for the 100 because the weld broke off from the stem to the cup, and it clogged extremely easy, especially when shooting ALCLAD through it. Although the actual performance of the 100 is great, the cup layout and concept is one of the worst perks of any brush I've owned or experimented with up to this point. I did have the Badger 200 at one point, because someone convinced me that a lot of my problems at the time would probably be fixed by a single action brush, so I took the chance. Sprayed one color through it, cleaned it out, threw it back in the box, and it was sold on ebay within ten days. Never again.... I like the pistol grip style of the TG series, because it's more comfortable for continued use when detailing, but I like still having the pen style brush so that I can still reach areas that the TG cannot always get to. I think after having used the XN this weekend that I've officially landed my airbrush setup that I'm happy with. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buffalowings Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Five weeks?? Holy fecal matter...maybe I should gently remind them that I already bought a Paasche Talon... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
scapilot Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I think they make honest efforts. Considering that they haven't charged me a dime yet for anything to be replaced is a good mantra to go by, but with my weird work hours, I was having a horrible time getting someone to answer their phone during business hours to try to request a replacement cup for the 100. Ken from Badger finally hit me up on here, and settled it, so again. I think their hearts are in the right direction. Perhaps a few more people working the refurb dept. could help out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kei Lau Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Like I said, I had to wait a while to hear something back about my 105 as well. It took about five weeks. In that time, I had picked up the Badger 100, and actually liked it a litle bit more, since it seemed to have finer control. I don't know, the Patriot was never consistent for me. I could be pulling off fine lines for a half hour no problem, and then I'd come back, and it was nearly impossible to repeat what I'd just done. Being that this was my very first airbrush, I was convinced that I was just not going to be able to learn to airbrush, and about gave it up. Thankfully, once I started using the 100, I was able to actually gauge my successes by having consistent results (both good and bad), but I could focus on what I needed to improve. I have kept my 100, but since I liked the Grex so much, I picked up their Genesis XN, and it came last week, and I'm about ready to just let my 100 go on ebay as well. Good as it's been, it holds no comparison to the results from the Grex line. The Badger 100/150 series is a good old faithful that have many followers, probably for good reason. I cannot comment because I never had one. The new Badger 105/155 series is a budget product that tries to compete on price only. I had one with the fine needle and it never work well enough for me. I am not sure it is the quality of Badger dropping. It may be more like that they ventured into the low end to try to compete in the cake decoration or cosmetics market. You can still get old Badger quality for modeling, but you have to get their Renegade series to get the quality of old. I agree. I was on the fence between the Genesis from Grex, or the Krome. I read some good things about both, but then I started reading some not so hopeful comments about the likelihood of the Krome down the road, and I'm just not keen on parting with that kind of money for something that isn't going to last. What is the "not so hopeful comments about the likelihood of the Krome down the road"? I have one and like it fine. Even though I don't use it very often because I also have an Iwata HP-CS and a H&S Evolution Silverline. The Iwata is still my "go-to" modeling airbrush, but if I can have only one airbrush, I can be happy with any of these three. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buffalowings Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Interesting, my patriot still works even with the seal problem, the performance is consistent, except when I try to make pencil thin lines (it might be pulsing from the compressor). Until I sold it, the 175 crescendo was my only airbrush and the 105 improves on it in several areas, mostly the smaller girth, the cutout rear handle and the gravity feed system. The seal issue just bothers me and waiting weeks for good customer service is a bit hard to swallow. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
scapilot Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 The Badger 100/150 series is a good old faithful that have many followers, probably for good reason. I cannot comment because I never had one. The new Badger 105/155 series is a budget product that tries to compete on price only. I had one with the fine needle and it never work well enough for me. I am not sure it is the quality of Badger dropping. It may be more like that they ventured into the low end to try to compete in the cake decoration or cosmetics market. You can still get old Badger quality for modeling, but you have to get their Renegade series to get the quality of old. With it being a newer brush and there being skepticism a out the quality of their newer stuff. Could totally be just an affordability issue as was stated. I'm not saying anything about their business having bad product. As I stated earlier. I like the action of my 100 and will keep it. The cup is an issue though and in my opinion you shouldn't be replacing anything on a decent product within a year. Much less two products. I was simply echoing the replies of others who have and are having the same issues I had. What is the "not so hopeful comments about the likelihood of the Krome down the road"? I have one and like it fine. Even though I don't use it very often because I also have an Iwata HP-CS and a H&S Evolution Silverline. The Iwata is still my "go-to" modeling airbrush, but if I can have only one airbrush, I can be happy with any of these three. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
balls47 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Five weeks?? Holy fecal matter...maybe I should gently remind them that I already bought a Paasche Talon... Hey buffalowings, How do you like your Paasche Talon? Also, when and where did you buy it? Thanks, balls47 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buffalowings Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 The talon is coming in today, I'll try and report back on the performance. Just a hint: amazon warehouse deals are good opportunity to buy an airbrush for cheap. Bought my 105 for $40 and the talon (hose/kit included) for the same price, saw a badger 100 for $40 today (good buy) but I would be patient because the prices constantly fluctuate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buffalowings Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Hey buffalowings, How do you like your Paasche Talon? Also, when and where did you buy it? Thanks, balls47 So I picked up the Talon today, the previous user who returned the airbrush to amazon bent one of the tips (and didn't include the third one altogether) the first one is intact and is usable. Overall, the biggest difference between the Talon and patriot is the trigger tension/feel. I'm actually more used to the badger so the Talon feels like it has excess play when pressing for air, the trigger pull is very smooth though. I really like the guard because I have snagged the exposed needle on the badger countless times. Some of the features on the Talon seem a bit excessive, like the spray pattern limiter on the back, which I don't see much of a purpose for. I would rather be able to remove the needle without removing the handle. The larger cup doesn't impeded vision, and actually helps prevent paint from spilling out if the airbrush is being moved around vigorously or at an ackward angle. Both are capable of producing hair thin lines, to be honest, I can't tell the difference in performance but I will try to get a better feel of both airbrushes later today. Also, I like the patriot's appearance more then the Talon, which seems more modern, with the laser etched eagle, and the lettering, but it also appears a bit tacky to my eyes, an airbrush is a tool, not some art deco/modern sculpture that I have in the lobby of my mansion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Neo Posted March 19, 2013 Author Share Posted March 19, 2013 I would not change my Badger I really love it. I did get Badger AB 101 document and in it there is a 3 step cleaning that they recommend. i think ive been over working mine i.e step 3 ONLY when necessary remove nozzle and regulator to clean.. i do this every time even between color I also read on Don Weilers site that one of the cause of bubbles in the cup is from dirt between the regulator and the body so i did a real nice clean up last night and i shall see today Cheers Neo Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buffalowings Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 A bit of an update: Ken replied to my email and this was his response, "air leakage at the connection between the body and nozzle head of the airbrush is common due to our finger tight assembly design. It should not affect the airbrush's spray performance. So do not be overly concerned with this, and avoid having liquid in this connection when using the airbrush.". I brought up another issue, excess trigger friction in comparison to the paasche and ken instantly offered to send me some airbrush lube, that's great customer service in my book. Also, I still prefer to use the patriot simply because I'm used to the feel of the brush. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Neo Posted March 19, 2013 Author Share Posted March 19, 2013 A bit of an update: Ken replied to my email and this was his response, "air leakage at the connection between the body and nozzle head of the airbrush is common due to our finger tight assembly design. It should not affect the airbrush's spray performance. So do not be overly concerned with this, and avoid having liquid in this connection when using the airbrush.". I brought up another issue, excess trigger friction in comparison to the paasche and ken instantly offered to send me some airbrush lube, that's great customer service in my book. Also, I still prefer to use the patriot simply because I'm used to the feel of the brush. Ok that sound logical but are you getting bubbles in your cup? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
buffalowings Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 With the original(fine) I did get bubbles, but I swapped them out with the medium conversion kit and the problem disappeared). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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