Doubt about P51 family painting...Help please

[Marcelo_P51D]

Hi guys. One of my difficulties is to select the right colors to paint any P51 Mustang.

We know that the P51 family consists of: P51A / A36 (Allison engine / diver bomber), P51B, P51C, P51D, F51D (Corea war), F82 Twin Mustang. In most cases, there are models painted in NMF.

Well, with the exception of P51A and A36 that are peinted in Olive Drab FS34087, and Raf's Mustangs, all other are NMF. My doubt is how to make a correct nmf paint. Wings, fuselage are different colors? What is the correct finished: a gloss mustang or matt one?

Thanks a lot. Marcelo

[Jennings]

Fuselage is natural metal. Wings:

http://s362974870.onlinehome.us/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=21362

[Slartibartfast]

USAAF P-51B and P-51C were delivered in O.D./Neutral Gray until 1944.

After that, wings (except flaps and ailerons) were painted silver while the rest of the airframe was natural aluminum with a few stainless steel panels. Rudders were silver-painted fabric. Elevators were also fabric until some point in the P-51D production run.

[Chuck1945]

...Well, with the exception of P51A and A36 that are peinted in Olive Drab FS34087, and Raf's Mustangs, all other are NMF...

Not quite. The OD ones were OD 41, the FS system didn't exist. Also when P-51Bs began arriving in England, they also were OD/Neutral Gray. NMF P-51Bs didn't start appearing until late Spring 1944. Finally, dont forget the P-51 in your list. Edited July 4, 2011 by Chuck1945

[blunce]

Finally, dont forget the P-51 in your list.

Ok, this has always confused me when looking at the Accurate Miniature lineup. Never did understand why there was just a "P-51" kit, when there were all the other variants as well. So what's the story with "P-51" w/o model letter attached?

[Grant in West Oz]

Ok, this has always confused me when looking at the Accurate Miniature lineup. Never did understand why there was just a "P-51" kit, when there were all the other variants as well. So what's the story with "P-51" w/o model letter attached?

The P-51 was the first production run for the British Purchasing Commission as Mustang I, from which 57 airframes were diverted to USA service.

So out of not many, most were converted to F-6 camera planes.

The subsequent identifiers (-B, -C, -D etc.) were to indicate major variations from the first design with sub designators for batches. e.g. P-51K-10, which may have a particular change incorporated on the line.

Clear as mud? :)

G

Edited July 4, 2011 by Grant in West Oz

[Jennings]

Technically the "P-51" should have been the P-51A regardless of its origin, once it got into USAAF service. Had that been done according to the usual policy, our beloved bubble top would have been the P-51E :)

[Chuck1945]

The original P-51 (RAF Mustang Ia) was cannon armed. The P-51A had the 4x.50 cal machine guns same as subsequently used on the P-51B/C. The original Mustang, the RAF Mustang I, had a mixed machine gun armament and no USAAF equivalent. There were other differences between all these as well, but the weapon fit is perhaps the most noticable difference.

[agboak]

Technically the "P-51" should have been the P-51A regardless of its origin, once it got into USAAF service. Had that been done according to the usual policy, our beloved bubble top would have been the P-51E :)

No. You are basing that comment on later practice. There was a P-40(no suffix) too. At the time, the first variant of any type in USAAC service carried no suffix letter, and the first variant carried the A suffix. How consistently it was applied I can't say, as opposed to the current practice which allows no exceptions.

[Jennings]

No. You are basing that comment on later practice. There was a P-40(no suffix) too. At the time, the first variant of any type in USAAC service carried no suffix letter, and the first variant carried the A suffix. How consistently it was applied I can't say, as opposed to the current practice which allows no exceptions.

It was *highly* variable, and remains so. That's why for the same basic airframe we have designations C-137, E-8, C-18, E-6, E-3, etc... A good system gone amuck.

[agboak]

I was merely referring to the "start with the A version", not all the other variations.

[Marcelo_P51D]

Ok guys. Let's review some points gradually:

1 - Colors to paint interior side of P51A or A36 USAAF including wheel wells and landing gear doors;

2 - Olive drab for A version: FS color doesn't exist, so wht is the correct color to paint a P51A/A36 with Allison engine? I saw a kit painted with FS34088 is that correct?

3 - talking about NMF with a friend, we can reach a conclusion, then i'll organize and post here;

4 - RAF MUSTANGS: some kits that i have are made by ACADEMY, like P51A and P51B. The first one, i'll buy another one because i find a interesting decal sheet from Moodel Alliance, reference number 72195. My intention is to build a RAF and a USAAF Mustang with an Allison engine. The question is: both airplanes used the same weapons? Just remember: i'll build a USAAF P51A not an A36, the diver bomber!

Well that's it...Thanks a lot. MArcelo

[B-17 guy]

2 - Olive drab for A version: FS color doesn't exist, so wht is the correct color to paint a P51A/A36 with Allison engine? I saw a kit painted with FS34088 is that correct?

I usually use the ANA 613 OD for WWII subjects.

[Chuck1945]

The WWII OD was Olive Drab #41. In 1942 the ANA colors were proposed to reduce duplication and to simplify the paint requirements for USAAF, USN and RAF aircraft built in the US. ANA 613 became the 'standard' replacement color for OD 41 and RAF Dark Green, however the USAAF did not adopt the ANA recommendations until late 1943 and by early 1944 had requested that camouflage paint no longer be applied, at least for ETO bound a/c. Stocks of OD 41 and Neutral Gray 43 were sufficiently large with the all the aircraft contractors, that there is considerable doubt if the ANA colors were ever applied to USAAF aircraft.

OD 41 differed in appearance both over time (it faded badly) and also from producers - witness the two different shades that can be seen on the vertical tail of any camouflaged B-17 - the parts coming pre-painted from different sub-contractors. The WWII OD 41 was close to FS 34087, but since the FS system didn't exist then it wasn't FS 34087 :) From a model painting perspective, almost any OD will work due to the variablity in actual paints, for example, even though Tamiya's OD is supposedly matched as closer to a US Army OD, it has a brownish cast that the WWII color often had when the 'new' was gone.

[tourist]

Ok guys. Let's review some points gradually:

1 - Colors to paint interior side of P51A or A36 USAAF including wheel wells and landing gear doors;

2 - Olive drab for A version: FS color doesn't exist, so wht is the correct color to paint a P51A/A36 with Allison engine? I saw a kit painted with FS34088 is that correct?

3 - talking about NMF with a friend, we can reach a conclusion, then i'll organize and post here;

4 - RAF MUSTANGS: some kits that i have are made by ACADEMY, like P51A and P51B. The first one, i'll buy another one because i find a interesting decal sheet from Moodel Alliance, reference number 72195. My intention is to build a RAF and a USAAF Mustang with an Allison engine. The question is: both airplanes used the same weapons? Just remember: i'll build a USAAF P51A not an A36, the diver bomber!

Well that's it...Thanks a lot. MArcelo

1- Interior Green cockpit.

Unpainted wells with a YZC spar, and unpainted interior on the doors w/ YZC anti rub strip.

2- See Chuck1945's answer above.

3- Not sure what you mean or what the question is.

4- The P-51A didn't have the chin mounted guns. The rest was the same.

[Marcelo_P51D]

1- Interior Green cockpit.

Unpainted wells with a YZC spar, and unpainted interior on the doors w/ YZC anti rub strip.

2- See Chuck1945's answer above.

3- Not sure what you mean or what the question is.

4- The P-51A didn't have the chin mounted guns. The rest was the same.

3- Not sure what you mean or what the question is. IT'S NOT A QUESTION. I have som informations for painting Mustngs in NMF...