Zvezda vs HB Mi-24 (1/72)

[cvrle]

Now for some comparison pics:

Hobbyboss up, Zvezda down:

Interior side:

Top view (Zvezda top, HB bottom)

Here we see a discrepancy - the Zvezda main rotor mast opening is more square that the rectangular HB one... The HB one corresponds to the 4+ plans, but looking at photos, I'm not sure that Zvezda is incorrect. I'm actually leaning towards thinking that Zvezda is the more accurate one.

And, finally, comparison of the engraved detail:

Zvezda:

HB:

Zvezda's panel lines are really, really, fine... Maybe too fine for some. There are some I'll add definition to, but others I'll leave as is. Btw, Zvezda's access panels in the above photos seem to represent the original with more fidelity.

Both good kits, I like Zvezda more, but that's subjective.

[pin]

One million rouble question - is the fuselage assymetric as it should be to compensate main rotor momentum ?

[Laurent]

  cvrle said:

The HB one corresponds to the 4+ plans, but looking at photos, I'm not sure that Zvezda is incorrect. I'm actually leaning towards thinking that Zvezda is the more accurate one.

I don't have the Mi-24 4+ book and I don't intend to buy it but I have several 4+ books. The plans are nice and detailed but I would be very cautious about their accuracy.

[tiger331]

Yes,Zvezda is assymetric as the original Hind and is superior to HB...

Also in cockpit are mayn details, although not all - especially right sied of the copilot´s cockpit, where are missing all controls of ATMs. HB has better weapons, but Zvezda are much better, let say are correct. HB has wrong nuber of rocket barrels in their B-8V-20 pods, when Zvezda has correctnumber of 20 barrels. And - you have perfect two fuel tanks, two gun pods with cannons UPK-23-250 and two rocket pods - it makes 6 items for four weapon stations... Is it not better than to have a lot, but not so correct???

Edited September 22, 2010 by tiger331

[MiG31]

Would you say that some of the HB parts can be used to add detail to the Zvezda kit, particularly the interior and cockpit? Or would such work be unnecessary?

[cvrle]

  Laurent said:

I don't have the Mi-24 4+ book and I don't intend to buy it but I have several 4+ books. The plans are nice and detailed but I would be very cautious about their accuracy.

You're completely right, Laurent. As i've mentioned, the main rotor mast opening in the top fuselage is depicted as rectangular on both the plans and the HB kit, but looking at the pictures, I'm thinking that the Zvezda kit with its more square opening is actually correct.

I mean, both kits look like a Mi-24, and are light-years ahead of the competition, but, for me, Zvezda is the one to go with. I just like it more, and it seems better to my eyes...

[MiG31]

For what it may be worth, here is an oblique photo showing the top of a de-rotored Mi-24V. From first glance it looks like the HB kit has it right, but I won't say for certain, since the angle doesn't help too much.

[pollie]

  MiG31 said:

For what it may be worth, here is an oblique photo showing the top of a de-rotored Mi-24V. From first glance it looks like the HB kit has it right, but I won't say for certain, since the angle doesn't help too much.

Not that it matters a great deal (probably), but that is actually a Mi-24D, not a V.

[MiG31]

Thanks. I'm not surprised, as Airliners.net has the occasional mis-captioned photo (KC-135Es mistaken for -135Rs, for instance). The thought did occur to me that the opening may be different between variants, and I wish I could find a better top-down view (of a Hind-E).

[Berkut]

Looking at the pictures i have saved on my pc, it seems there is a shape difference in that area between models of real Mi-24. If it is shape difference regarding the "hole" it self or not, i am not sure. Anyway, to me it looks like the Zvezda is correct one when comparing it to the pictures. And lets just say i honestly trust Zvezda more.

Thank you very much for the comparing, it is very interesting to see so many subtle differences. (door, tail, exhaust pipe size, cockpit size etc...)

Edited September 24, 2010 by Berkut

[ice225]

  tiger331 said:

Yes,Zvezda is assymetric as the original Hind and is superior to HB...

...and that's the show stopper for the HB. If the kit is not asymmetric it's NO Mi-24.

[Fiddler]

In what sence are you talking about assymetric? the tail surface or is it somewhere else?

Now that I have 2 on order, who's doing a Super Hind III conversion as I would love to see an Algerian example in my collection

Edited September 25, 2010 by Fiddler

[Flankerman]

  Fiddler said:

In what sence are you talking about assymetric? the tail surface or is it somewhere else?

If you look at a real Mi-24 from directly head-on, the front cockpit is perfectly vertical.

But immediately behind the rear cockpit, the whole fuselage is tilted to starboard by about 2.5deg (IIRC).

This is the counteract the offset thrust from the main rotor and take some load off the tail rotor.

The 'twist' is very subtle - but you can definitely see it directly from the front.

You can also see it in the rear bulkhead shown in the Zvezda sprue shots.

I have a drawing - and a photo - showing the twist - but I am away from my home computer just now.

Ken

[Hajo L.]

Ice, I have the HB Mi-24 here. You can take a look when you come to get the new cutter blades!

HAJO

[Thorsten Wieking]

  ice225 said:

...and that's the show stopper for the HB. If the kit is not asymmetric it's NO Mi-24.

Do not be too harsh with that kit. For years, for decades all we had were Italeri, Airfix/Heller or Hasegawa moulds. And every kit did look like a Mi-24 (even with rotors turning the wrong direction), could be recognized as the big russian helicopter with troop capability that we as 12 - 14 something old boys heard about when starting with this hobby.

What I wonder - even with the 2,5 degree tilt in the Zvezda kit, it still is made out of polystyrene with wall thinknesses way beyond the real think scaled down to 72. So is that 2,5 degree, even if it is noticable in 1:72, that important so that the HB kit is suddenly dismissed as incorrect?

Cheers

Thorsten

[ice225]

  Thorsten Wieking said:

Do not be too harsh with that kit. For years, for decades all we had were Italeri, Airfix/Heller or Hasegawa moulds. And every kit did look like a Mi-24 (even with rotors turning the wrong direction), could be recognized as the big russian helicopter with troop capability that we as 12 - 14 something old boys heard about when starting with this hobby.

What I wonder - even with the 2,5 degree tilt in the Zvezda kit, it still is made out of polystyrene with wall thinknesses way beyond the real think scaled down to 72. So is that 2,5 degree, even if it is noticable in 1:72, that important so that the HB kit is suddenly dismissed as incorrect?

Yes, you are right and I really was too harsh in my words. Of course the other Mi-24 kits look like a Mi-24 and a non-expert eye will not see the differences when build. On the other hand the better kit wins over the good one.

[tiger331]

  Thorsten Wieking said:

Do not be too harsh with that kit. For years, for decades all we had were Italeri, Airfix/Heller or Hasegawa moulds. And every kit did look like a Mi-24 (even with rotors turning the wrong direction), could be recognized as the big russian helicopter with troop capability that we as 12 - 14 something old boys heard about when starting with this hobby.

What I wonder - even with the 2,5 degree tilt in the Zvezda kit, it still is made out of polystyrene with wall thinknesses way beyond the real think scaled down to 72. So is that 2,5 degree, even if it is noticable in 1:72, that important so that the HB kit is suddenly dismissed as incorrect?

Cheers

Thorsten

It is not about polystyrene wall thickness, not about only 2.5 deg tilt, it is about all appearance. If you want so far the most CORRECT Hind - it is Zvezda. HB has better cockpits (not saying correct), but everything else is better on Zvezda... And it is FINALLY as the FIRST Hind model tilted... It does not mean to throw all these old models out to the rubbish bin - giveit to those 10 - 14 years old young modellers... And, believe me, they will be happy (if you find some in this computerised world...)

For me, who flew Hind for more than 20 years - Zvezda did ultimate Hind model and there will be for 99% no better one in the future.

[Thorsten Wieking]

  tiger331 said:

[...] it is about all appearance. [....]

For me, who flew Hind for more than 20 years - Zvezda did ultimate Hind model and there will be for 99% no better one in the future.

Okay, this is another aspect if the whole appearance is better. I was mainly aiming at the 2.5 degree tilt thing. Of course, with you being a former Hind pilot, you have quite an unique perspectiv on that helo.

(Although I must admit that I couldn't care less about finer details the Mercedes' I drove in the past 7 years - just cars, just an employer)

Cheers

Thorsten

[tiger331]

OK Thorsten,

no prob :-)

Have a good modelling, not only HInds :-)

[J.C. Bahr]

  tiger331 said:

For me, who flew Hind for more than 20 years - Zvezda did ultimate Hind model and there will be for 99% no better one in the future.

Cool!... quite the endorsement!