steel_tiger1 Posted September 15, 2010 Share Posted September 15, 2010 Ok i have picked up 2 more 1/32 Trumpeter SU30 MKK's for $50 ea. (makes a total of 5 1/32 flankers, I may need to see a shrink). I now need to know if there are any plans available to determine the differences between the MKK's and the MK2's & MKI's. From looking at photo's it appears that tails seem to be the main differences. I am sure the cockpits are different. Any help is appreciated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
loftycomfort Posted September 15, 2010 Share Posted September 15, 2010 I believe MKI's are canard Flankers built for India. Terry Quote Link to post Share on other sites
steel_tiger1 Posted September 16, 2010 Author Share Posted September 16, 2010 I believe MKI's are canard Flankers built for India. From looking at photos on airliners.net they don't all have canards. I read somewhere that they have been dropped out of production, I think. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mingwin Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 From looking at photos on airliners.net they don't all have canards. I read somewhere that they have been dropped out of production, I think. ah... that's very new to me... always tough that MKI was only with canards... (does it have changed lately, like yesterday? or this morning?) :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Floggerman Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 (edited) very interesting documentation here: http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-Flanker.html Edited September 16, 2010 by Floggerman Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flankerman Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 The Su-30MKK and Su-30MKI are two totally different machines. They are built at separate factories - the MKI at Irkutsk (IAPO), the MKK at Komsomolsk-na-Amur (KnAAPO). The Su-30MKI was built specifically for India and uses Israeli, Indian and Russian avionics. There are derivatives - the Su-30MKM for Malaysia that drops the Israeli avionics and has South African & Swedish missile warning systems (so some bumps and aerials) and the Su-30MKA for Algeria. The Su-30MKK was built for China and uses Chinese and Russian avionics. The derivatives are Su-30MK2V for Vietnam, Venezuela and Indonesia... Visual differences are :- The Su-30MKI has canards, thrust-vectoring engine (TVC) nozzles, and bigger, extended-chord rudders. The Su-30MKK has no canards, no TVC and taller, square-tipped fins containing fuel tanks. Making a Su-30MKI/M/A from a Su-30MKK is quite an undertaking. I made a Su-30MKI and MKM from the Heller 1:72 scale Su-27UB here which shows the basics that need to be done. Starting with an MKK should be easier as you already have the IFR probe, offset IRST and twin nosewheels. You can sort out the internals yourself - it wasn't too much in 1:72 scale, but in 1:32 you would have to do some scratchbuilding. BTW, the last letter denotes the user.... MKI for India MKM for Malaysia MKA for Algeria MKK for Kitei (China) The Vietnamese, Venezuelan and Indonesian all seem to use the MK2V designation. Welcome to the confusing world of Flankers. Happy Modelling Ken Quote Link to post Share on other sites
loftycomfort Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 Btw, Wolfpack Design is releasing a conversion set to make a 1/32 canard flanker. Terry Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dthank Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 The more intriguing question is: where did you get two Su-30MKK kits for $50 ea???? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
steel_tiger1 Posted September 16, 2010 Author Share Posted September 16, 2010 The Su-30MKK and Su-30MKI are two totally different machines.They are built at separate factories - the MKI at Irkutsk (IAPO), the MKK at Komsomolsk-na-Amur (KnAAPO). The Su-30MKI was built specifically for India and uses Israeli, Indian and Russian avionics. There are derivatives - the Su-30MKM for Malaysia that drops the Israeli avionics and has South African & Swedish missile warning systems (so some bumps and aerials) and the Su-30MKA for Algeria. The Su-30MKK was built for China and uses Chinese and Russian avionics. The derivatives are Su-30MK2V for Vietnam, Venezuela and Indonesia... Visual differences are :- The Su-30MKI has canards, thrust-vectoring engine (TVC) nozzles, and bigger, extended-chord rudders. The Su-30MKK has no canards, no TVC and taller, square-tipped fins containing fuel tanks. Making a Su-30MKI/M/A from a Su-30MKK is quite an undertaking. I made a Su-30MKI and MKM from the Heller 1:72 scale Su-27UB here which shows the basics that need to be done. Starting with an MKK should be easier as you already have the IFR probe, offset IRST and twin nosewheels. You can sort out the internals yourself - it wasn't too much in 1:72 scale, but in 1:32 you would have to do some scratchbuilding. BTW, the last letter denotes the user.... MKI for India MKM for Malaysia MKA for Algeria MKK for Kitei (China) The Vietnamese, Venezuelan and Indonesian all seem to use the MK2V designation. Welcome to the confusing world of Flankers. Happy Modelling Ken Thanks Flankerman it gives me someplace to start looking comparing the detail differences. ah... that's very new to me...always tough that MKI was only with canards... (does it have changed lately, like yesterday? or this morning?) I found at least a dozen pictures of MKI's with out canards, granted some could have been the same aircraft I didn't look that close. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
steel_tiger1 Posted September 16, 2010 Author Share Posted September 16, 2010 The more intriguing question is: where did you get two Su-30MKK kits for $50 ea???? A distributor closeout but I can tell you they were the only 2 left. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alex Sidharta Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 The Vietnamese, Venezuelan and Indonesian all seem to use the MK2V designation.Ken Indonesia uses "MK" and "MK2" designation for the Su-30s, and "SK" and "SKM" for the Su-27s. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flankerman Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 Thanks Flankerman it gives me someplace to start looking comparing the detail differences.I found at least a dozen pictures of MKI's with out canards, granted some could have been the same aircraft I didn't look that close. They aren't MKI's. When India ordered the upgraded Su-30MKI, they were delivered an interim variant, without canards or TVC - while the full-blown version was being developed. This was called the Su-30K and there were 18 of them - they wore a standard 3-tone camo scheme and were numbered SB001 to SB-018. The first 'true' MKI - with canards, TVC etc was numbered SB-019 and featured the all-grey camouflage. It's all explained in this book...... Ken Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flankerman Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 Indonesia uses "MK" and "MK2" designation for the Su-30s, and "SK" and "SKM" for the Su-27s. Thanks Alex - I got it wrong. But, am I right is saying that the Indonesian Su-30MK, the Vietnamese Su-30MK2V and the Venezuelan Su-30MK2V are all the same - at least visually?? e.g tall, square-tipped fins, no canards or TVC. All built by KnAAPO. Ken Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zactoman Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 They aren't MKI's.When India ordered the upgraded Su-30MKI, they were delivered an interim variant, without canards or TVC - while the full-blown version was being developed. This was called the Su-30K and there were 18 of them - they wore a standard 3-tone camo scheme and were numbered SB001 to SB-018. India is also operating what they call the MK-1, not to be confused with the MKI : http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Images/C...Fighters/Su30K/I read somewhere that 10 (or was it 8?) of the Su-30Ks they bought were later upgraded to MKI standards. Perhaps these are the MK-1 designations? Confusing... :wacko: Btw, Wolfpack Design is releasing a conversion set to make a 1/32 canard flanker.Wolfpack has announced that it is releasing an Su-30K conversion. This is not the canard version.Ok i have picked up 2 more 1/32 Trumpeter SU30 MKK's for $50 ea. (makes a total of 5 1/32 flankers, I may need to see a shrink).Rather than spend your money on a shrink you may want to visit my website first to see all the cool corrections, conversions and upgrades I have for the Su-27/30!www.Zactomodels.com There are some problems with the Su-30 kit that I will be addressing soon. The canopy shape is quite a bit off and lacks detail. The IRST location and platform shape is wrong requiring that the front section of the fuselage be replaced. I'll also be dressing up the refueling probe and adding the missing spotlight panel on the right side of the nose. Another big problem with the Trumpeter Su-30 kit is that the entire weapons array that they include can't be used without first doing some heavy modification and scratchbuilding. >>>Details here.<<< Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flankerman Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 India is also operating what they call the MK-1, not to be confused with the MKI : http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Images/C...Fighters/Su30K/I read somewhere that 10 (or was it 8?) of the Su-30Ks they bought were later upgraded to MKI standards. Perhaps these are the MK-1 designations? Confusing... Chris, I have never seen that designation used - it isn't mentioned in the book I quoted (which was written in co-operation with the Indian AF and the Bharat Rakshak site). If they were operating them, they aren't now..... According to the book.... the original Su-30K's (or Su-30 MK-1) - coded SB-001 to SB-018.... "In a surprise move, the IAF's 18 Su-30K (aircraft SB001-018) which were originally slated to be upgraded at Irkutsk were sold back to Russia in February 2006......" They were replaced by 18 'proper' MKI's from Russia. It was discovered that they (the Su-30Ks) could not be upgraded to MKI standard because..... To accomodate TVC, the entire rear end would need to be replaced. The rest of the airframe structure would have to changed to take the extra two tonnes of the MKI airframe. The internal structure for the canards was not present in the Su-30K airframe. They had already used up 40 percent of their airframe lives. The Indian AF is now only operating the Su-30MKI - currently SB-019 to about SB-150 The first batch were made at Irkutsk, the rest are produced in India by Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) - with up to 248 aircraft planned. Ken Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zactoman Posted September 16, 2010 Share Posted September 16, 2010 I have never seen that designation usedWhat happened to the good ol days of A, B, C, D etc.? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
steel_tiger1 Posted September 17, 2010 Author Share Posted September 17, 2010 Rather than spend your money on a shrink you may want to visit my website first to see all the cool corrections, conversions and upgrades I have for the Su-27/30!www.Zactomodels.com There are some problems with the Su-30 kit that I will be addressing soon. The canopy shape is quite a bit off and lacks detail. The IRST location and platform shape is wrong requiring that the front section of the fuselage be replaced. I'll also be dressing up the refueling probe and adding the missing spotlight panel on the right side of the nose. My paypal account and you are already well aquainted. I have taken a little break from your website to pick up some more of the Aires sets for the exhausts. I will be returning to you as soon as you get those darn 2 seat canopies done. I now need 3 MKK's & 2 UB's. I have a full set of your stuff to do my single seater. Plus I got an A7D I need parts for.......argh! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
steel_tiger1 Posted September 17, 2010 Author Share Posted September 17, 2010 (edited) This was called the Su-30K and there were 18 of them - they wore a standard 3-tone camo scheme and were numbered SB001 to SB-018 Would I be better off to look more toward Chinese & Venezualan Flankers? I want to do a Russian demo MKK and a Chinese version and the third is open. Edited September 17, 2010 by steel_tiger1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alex Sidharta Posted September 17, 2010 Share Posted September 17, 2010 Thanks Alex - I got it wrong.But, am I right is saying that the Indonesian Su-30MK, the Vietnamese Su-30MK2V and the Venezuelan Su-30MK2V are all the same - at least visually?? e.g tall, square-tipped fins, no canards or TVC. All built by KnAAPO. Ken Of course, Ken... You are right, as always... I'm so proud as we have the SKM now... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
signals Posted May 3, 2012 Share Posted May 3, 2012 The set from Wolfpack show available on their site...but can't figure out where to buy it stateside? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dehowie Posted May 3, 2012 Share Posted May 3, 2012 Visits to Chris's website are always expensive!! But worth every cent... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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