F-15E in Desert Storm questions

[M.F.Lunder]

Hi guys,

 

I am building a couple of Eagles in desert storm:

http://www.arcforums.com/forums/air/index.php?/topic/331415-eagleeagleeagle/

 

For the C model, I already applied the knowledge I've learnt here, but I still have some questions regarding the E model, quite similar to the C model.

They are:

1, Was the grill of JFS removed?

2,Was the tail hook faring reimoved?

3, Were the sabre drains removed?

4, On the Hasegawa E model kit (as well as their C model) , there are 2 little antenna between the larges one on the front fuselage, what are they? I looked through the pics on dstorm.eu, it seems those little one are not there, should I remove them？

 

5, Are there any strengthen plates on the vertical stabilizer? 

 

Thank you very much, 

Chris

[Niels]

1 hour ago, M.F.Lunder said:

2,Was the tail hook faring reimoved?

4, On the Hasegawa E model kit (as well as their C model) , there are 2 little antenna between the larges one on the front fuselage, what are they? I looked through the pics on dstorm.eu, it seems those little one are not there, should I remove them？

Hi Chris 

 

Checked my reference photos, and it seems that the tailhook fairing was present on all the C/D's that I have found online. I am sure others can chime in and clarify more. 
The 2 antennas (one on each side) should be the AOA indicators, and you need to leave these in place as they are on all F-15's

[M.F.Lunder]

23 minutes ago, Niels said:

Hi Chris 

 

Checked my reference photos, and it seems that the tailhook fairing was present on all the C/D's that I have found online. I am sure others can chime in and clarify more. 
The 2 antennas (one on each side) should be the AOA indicators, and you need to leave these in place as they are on all F-15's

 

Hi Niels, thanks for replying!

 

Yes all the C/Ds had the faring at the time, therefore it's logical to think that the Es also have it. I remember someone mentioned here the faring on C/D were removed in mid 90s but I am not sure about the Es, I hope I can have a confirmatinon on that.

As for the other question, I didn't mean the AOA sensors, I was referring to the antenna in front of the front nose wheel well. If you can see the picture I posted, I was talking about those 2 the arrow pointing at. It seems there is one on C and none on E, but I am just not sure because I can't find a picture of that time clear enough to tell,

 

Oh, looking at your signiture, can you tell me what is the occasion of OBI WAN says "A Gentleman waist less by travelling light"? Never heard of that before.

 

Thanks,

Chris

[Niels]

Hehe Chris - it is something Obi Wan Kenobi says in Star Wars IV, A New Hope 😁

[M.F.Lunder]

24 minutes ago, Niels said:

Hehe Chris - it is something Obi Wan Kenobi says in Star Wars IV, A New Hope 😁

😧😧😧Whaaaaaaaaaaaat...I believe I have watched ep4 hundreds of times...

[Crash Test Dummy]

F-15E models never had tail hook fairings or the grill over the JFS starter. They left the assembly line without them. In the '90s the fighter fleet was modified to match.

[M.F.Lunder]

18 minutes ago, Crash Test Dummy said:

F-15E models never had tail hook fairings or the grill over the JFS starter. They left the assembly line without them. In the '90s the fighter fleet was modified to match.

 

Thank you! Thank you! This is the information I need!

 

[Niels]

2 hours ago, M.F.Lunder said:

😧😧😧Whaaaaaaaaaaaat...I believe I have watched ep4 hundreds of times...

It's from the scene in the cantina in Mos Eisley, where Han Solo askes what the cargo is. 

[Quixote74]

1 hour ago, Niels said:

It's from the scene in the cantina in Mos Eisley, where Han Solo askes what the cargo is. 

Unless this is something from a deleted scene or a translated version, gonna have to question the accuracy on that quote.  Obi Wan's response to the cargo question is:

 

"No cargo, only passengers. Myself, the boy, two droids... and no questions asked."

(Memorable in part because that last sentence usually wins the "Star Wars lines that are creepy out of context" contest 🙊)

 

I think the line you're actually referencing comes earlier, when Obi Wan rescues Luke from the Tuskens. He tells him "The Jundland Wastes are not to be traveled lightly." (Jundland Wastes being the name of the desolate region of Tattooine they're in at that time).

 

Circling back to the OP's inquiry, I believe all your questions were answered except the reinforcement plates on the fins, which were there for all production F-15Es.

 

Another detail to be aware of for early Strike Eagles is the small intakes on the CFTs just below/behind the wing trailing edge.  Those were for a later, uprated F100 engine that wasn't in production yet for the 4th TFW birds that served in Desert Storm.  Just leave them off if your kit/conversion has the parts.

 

Also, if your kit has it molded on, remove the GPS "pimple" on the dorsal surface starboard of the airbrake.  That was another feature that didn't come about until post-1991.

[Ben Brown]

Those original intakes on the sides of the CFTs were rectangular pop out doors that were open on the ground. The actuator inside looked like a small coilover shock from a car and everything inside the intake is white. I’ve got a couple of closeup photos around here that I can scan if you need them.
 

I’m not seeing the two small antennas OP is pointing out. There are a couple of small, square, light grey, flush mounted antennas there. I can scan a pic that shows those too. My pics were taken in late 1991 or early 92, IIRC. 
 

Ben

[M.F.Lunder]

20 hours ago, Quixote74 said:

Another detail to be aware of for early Strike Eagles is the small intakes on the CFTs just below/behind the wing trailing edge.  Those were for a later, uprated F100 engine that wasn't in production yet for the 4th TFW birds that served in Desert Storm.  Just leave them off if your kit/conversion has the parts.

 

17 hours ago, Ben Brown said:

Those original intakes on the sides of the CFTs were rectangular pop out doors that were open on the ground. The actuator inside looked like a small coilover shock from a car and everything inside the intake is white. I’ve got a couple of closeup photos around here that I can scan if you need them.

 

Hi Quixote74 and Ben, good news: now I how to make it accurate, this area is always in the shadow of the wing, that's why I totally missed it

bad news: I already glue the intake!🤣🤣

 

And Ben, I will be appreciated if you share the photo of the original intake. From the model's stand point, I will only scribe the outline of the pop-up door, so a photo shows the size and positon is alright. I am also interested in what the part look like as this is totally new for me!

 

17 hours ago, Ben Brown said:

tere are a couple of small, square, light grey, flush mounted antennas there. I can scan a pic that shows those too. My pics were taken in late 1991 or early 92, IIRC. 

 

I think I understand what you are talking about, I found the following photo:

 

Yes I am also interest in the actual antenna as I will also scibe those on my E  One samll question: those antennas are not always noticeable, could it be the angle of the photo becase they are flush mounted or they were also painted gunshop as the fuselage？

 

Now only one question remains: the sabre drain- the two small fin under the each engine, were they there/removed/never existed on Es?

 

The foece is with ARCers, always!

Thanks again, 

Chris

 

[Ben Brown]

Hi Chris,

 

I’ll scan those photos for you. I’m getting pulled in multiple directions right now so it might take a day or two. I’ll check to see if I have any photos of the Sabre drain area, too. I was living near Seymour Johnson AFB back when the F-15E started to arrive and spent a lot of time studying them so I could make the Hasegawa kit more accurate.
 

When the F-15Es were new, those flush mounted antennas were off white. The rectangular one just forward of the windscreen was light grey, as was the blade antenna aft of the canopy. The radome color was very close to that of the airframe. After they returned home, the replacement (repainted?) radomes were a much darker grey.

For the markings, during Desert Storm the wing badge still had “4th Tactical Fighter Wing” instead of the later “4th Wing.” The squadron badges still had “Tactical Fighter Squadron” instead of just “Fighter Squadron.” The eagle on the inboard sides of the vertical stabs were usually Neutral Grey. 
 

Ben

[Murph]

The two small antennas were not on the E model.

 

Regards,

Murph

[Ben Brown]

Here are some scans for you. The runway pics were taken before Desert Storm, I think right before they left as part of Desert Shield. You can seen how the radome color is lighter than in post war photos. The others were taken at an air show in 1993, but should still be representative of a DS jet.

 

Arrestor hook.

 

Antennas.

 

CFT air scoops.

 

Where is the sabre drain you mentioned located on the F-15? I'll see if I have a photo of it. I don't see anything that looks like a sabre drain on the E.

 

Ben

[BoeingDriver]

I worked Strikes at SJ for 9 years so here are the answers to your questions:

 

- No Sabre Drains 

- No to the 2 small antennas on the bottom between the UHF/TACAN antenna's (the white square antennas are radio altimeters)

- Heat exchanger inlet doors on the CFT's (up until the last few years, a -220 thing only)

- JFS exhaust louvers removed 

- No hook fairing

 

 

 

[kellyF15]

90-0233 was the first -229 jet.  90-0227 was a -220 jet. As far as the rest of the items, I didn't start working them until 1999. I never worked C/D models, But I believe the panels/fairings outboard of the exhaust were different, because we didn't have to remove them on strike eagles to R2 the engines.

[M.F.Lunder]

Thank you Ben, Murph, BoeingDriver and kellyF15 for sharing the information, they are valuable and interesting not only for a modeller but also for a fan.

 

 

 

On 4/12/2023 at 6:18 AM, Murph said:

The two small antennas were not on the E model.

Are they on the C models during Desert Storm？

 

Chris

[Murph]

16 hours ago, M.F.Lunder said:

Are they on the C models during Desert Storm？

 

Chris

 

Yes, but the number of antennas depended on the base.  Eglin C models only had one of the antennas, while Langley, Bitburg, and Soesterburg C models had two.  The B and D models didn't use them, and many A models didn't have them either.  You can check the pictures here:  LINK

 

Regards,

Murph

Edited April 14, 2023 by Murph

[habu2]

I just want to commend Murph for consistently being a wealth of first-hand information. 👍

[M.F.Lunder]

3 hours ago, Murph said:

 

Yes, but the number of antennas depended on the base.  Eglin C models only had one of the antennas, while Langley, Bitburg, and Soesterburg C models had two.  The B and D models didn't use them, and many A models didn't have them either.  You can check the pictures here:  LINK

 

Regards,

Murph

 

Hi Murph, 

Great! I have the same obervation when going through dstorm.eu. Your confirmation is just what I need!

Thanks again,

Chris

Edited April 14, 2023 by M.F.Lunder

[M.F.Lunder]

6 minutes ago, habu2 said:

I just want to commend Murph for consistently being a wealth of first-hand information. 👍

Exactly!

[Murph]

 

[M.F.Lunder]

Hi  Ben, Murph, BoeingDriver and kellyF15, are the pop up door on the CFT always open, or they are only open when in use, say, starting the engine? Can I be just lazy😂 and scribe the outline of the door instead of rebuilt the whole thing?

 

Another qustion is about the rockeyes, the Hasegawa instrution says to paint them green, but I've seen some online photos and others' built of them painted white, which should be the correct color?

 

Thanks again, 

Chris

[Ben Brown]

I’ll have to defer to the guys who actually have hands on experience with the F-15E. All I did was photograph them at air shows and watch them longingly from the Wilbur’s BBQ parking lot. 😄 Looks like the scoops were open when the engines are shut down.

 

Ben

Edited April 24, 2023 by Ben Brown

[kellyF15]

6 hours ago, M.F.Lunder said:

Hi  Ben, Murph, BoeingDriver and kellyF15, are the pop up door on the CFT always open, or they are only open when in use, say, starting the engine? Can I be just lazy😂 and scribe the outline of the door instead of rebuilt the whole thing?

 

Another qustion is about the rockeyes, the Hasegawa instrution says to paint them green, but I've seen some online photos and others' built of them painted white, which should be the correct color?

 

Thanks again, 

Chris

They are open on the ground even with the engine operating.  They are the Primary Heat Exchanger inlets.