Pledge Future

[adrianosouza]

Hi guys,

Do you guys know if i can achieve that "super-glossy- pledge-future-surface-for-decalling" using Mr.Color clear gloss ?? I mean, Pledge future seems to be THE varnish of choice for most modellers here but is that due to the great cost benefit of having 800ml of varnish for a low price ? Or is it due to its unique gloss ?

I`m asking this because i tried to work with future for a long time and always failed to get a glossy surface. So now i`m shifting to Mr.Colors but that question remais..

thanks

Edited April 10, 2014 by adrianosouza

[Devilleader501]

I have found a few really cool uses for future not only the gloss you can achieve with it, and the dunking clear parts into it. I use it to lay my decals down without spraying the entire model by just placing a small amount directly where the decal goes and use a q-tip to pull the excess future from under the decal. When it sets up it acts like glue and pulls the decal into panels and rivets without having to use setting solutions.

Another thing I have started using it for is gluing my canopies on with. I put a small amount in a disposable cup over night then peel the thick hardened layer off the top. Underneath is a thick form of future that you can apply with a toothpick. When it dries its hard and crystal clear. That and because of the reasons you stated being very cheap and just as good. Also I use only enamels and future puts an invulnerable barrier between my paint and me accidentally ruining it because of thinners and stuff I use to get the effects I get when weathering.

[adrianosouza]

I have found a few really cool uses for future not only the gloss you can achieve with it, and the dunking clear parts into it. I use it to lay my decals down without spraying the entire model by just placing a small amount directly where the decal goes and use a q-tip to pull the excess future from under the decal. When it sets up it acts like glue and pulls the decal into panels and rivets without having to use setting solutions.

Another thing I have started using it for is gluing my canopies on with. I put a small amount in a disposable cup over night then peel the thick hardened layer off the top. Underneath is a thick form of future that you can apply with a toothpick. When it dries its hard and crystal clear. That and because of the reasons you stated being very cheap and just as good. Also I use only enamels and future puts an invulnerable barrier between my paint and me accidentally ruining it because of thinners and stuff I use to get the effects I get when weathering.

Yes, I`m aware of the different uses we can make of future. I also use it for claear parts and other stuff but no matter what i do it won`t work as varnish ! I`ve seen people using it and getting an incredible coat of high gloss finish and i could never get anywhere close to that, that`s why i decided to try something else.. In my current build i am going to try Mr.Color Clear Gloss.. But the question i`m asking is: Is it worth trying to persue same level of gloss using Mr.Color or other regular varnishes ? Or that gloss can only be achieved with future and future only ?

Here`s what i`m talking about:

Also i have a question: What is the correct way to spray future with airbrush ? Should i spray several thin coats and letting it dry in between coats ? or should i spray a fair amount at once ?

Edited April 10, 2014 by adrianosouza

[galileo1]

The general rule of thumb with Future is several thin layers and, I think, Chuck achieved what you posted in that pic above using several layers of the stuff (if I remember correctly when I read it). It's indeed possible. You just have get there slowly.

Rob

[adrianosouza]

It's indeed possible. You just have get there slowly.

You mean using Mr.Color ?

Edited April 10, 2014 by adrianosouza

[Paolo Maglio]

Both Mr. Colour or Tamiya clears works well (better for me) than Future to give the model a gloss coat, but they are much more expensive. To make a canopy krystal klear or to tint it nothing works like Future.

[Aigore]

I found that making a mix of 60% future and 40% window cleaner air brushes really nice and you get really even coats, I usually put down 3 coats of this mix on a model to achieve high gloss.

[Lucas C.]

Both Mr. Colour or Tamiya clears works well (better for me) than Future to give the model a gloss coat, but they are much more expensive. To make a canopy krystal klear or to tint it nothing works like Future.

What do you use to tint Future? Food coloring? Paint? How much tint do you add? I've been thinking about how to tint canopies but have been afraid to pull the trigger on a real one for fear of screwing it up.

[adrianosouza]

Both Mr. Colour or Tamiya clears works well (better for me) than Future to give the model a gloss coat, but they are much more expensive. To make a canopy krystal klear or to tint it nothing works like Future.

A clear coat like that phantom in the picture ? Or somewhere near ? If yes than that's all i wanted to hear.

[Paolo Maglio]

What do you use to tint Future? Food coloring? Paint? How much tint do you add? I've been thinking about how to tint canopies but have been afraid to pull the trigger on a real one for fear of screwing it up.

I use inks from Pentel fountain brushes for Japanese calligraphy. Tried food colour but was unappy with the result.

[Paolo Maglio]

A clear coat like that phantom in the picture ? Or somewhere near ? If yes than that's all i wanted to hear.

yes, thin Tamiya or Gunze or Mr. COlour clears with Laquer Thinner called Mr. Thinner, keep the pressure very low and you will get that kind of clear coat.

[adrianosouza]

yes, thin Tamiya or Gunze or Mr. COlour clears with Laquer Thinner called Mr. Thinner, keep the pressure very low and you will get that kind of clear coat.

Great to know that Paolo. Now i'm more relieved knowing i can continue in my endless jorney to eliminate silverings ! Thanks a lot

[RichardL]

Hi guys,

Do you guys know if i can achieve that "super-glossy- pledge-future-surface-for-decalling" using Mr.Color clear gloss ??

You certainly can achieve a super gloss with Mr. Color clear gloss. I think Pledge/Future is more cost effective than anything. You can achieve the same or better gloss with Mr. Color or Alclad with less work. Below is a pic showing my test drop tank just after two successive coats of Gunze Aqueous H30 Gloss over rough flat paints:

[adrianosouza]

That is great Richard.

I tried future a dozen times and always failed miserably, LOL. Last time i used i even sanded the whole paint with 1200 - 2000 paper but without the faintest improvement ! Last thing i tried was "Humbrol Clear Gloss Varnish", that one which supposedly replaces future and it completely ruined my paint, leaving white stains all over it. Seriously i didn't know what to do anymore but that picture of your drop tanks just restored my hopes. What is most impressive is that you said you applied it directly to a rough flat paint, without sanding it.

Can't wait to try. I'll post my results here as soon as i got it finished

Thanks a lot !

Adriano

[Bigasshammm]

You have to also remember that there's a lot of prep that goes into getting a gloss like that. On that F-4 that Chuck built it was meticulously prepared and I believe he even smooths the paint before applying any form of gloss clear. Just applying Future onto a rough flat surface will only give you a certain level of shine.

I always brush my Future on as well. Never had luck with the airbrush and all the clean up involved.

The greatest benefit of Future to me is that it is removable. If you screw something up or get a big nasty run you can easily remove it with some window cleaner on a rag or q-tip. Other actual gloss clears dry like a rock and are impossible to remove without sanding the entire model.

[chuck540z3]

Here`s what i`m talking about:

Also i have a question: What is the correct way to spray future with airbrush ? Should i spray several thin coats and letting it dry in between coats ? or should i spray a fair amount at once ?

Hi Guys,

Funny that I checked out this thread and found my Phantom used as an example. By coincidence, I am spraying Future right now on my A-10C build and I have a big change to how I apply Future from now on.

First of all, why Future? While other gloss coats will work just as good (or better in some cases), what I really like about Future is that I can remove it with Windex if I crash and burn and need to re-do it. A good example of a problem is if the surface was quite greasy and the Future pebbles up or if you have a lot of crap trapped within the gloss coat. A rag soaked in Windex will remove it and then you can start again.

The F-4E pic above was accomplished with a mixture of 75% Future combined with 25% Windex to dilute the Future a bit and allow it to be sprayed as a thinner coat than straight out of the bottle. This was followed by a straight coat of 100% Windex, which "re-melted" the Future and let it lay down even smoother than before.

Since Future out of the bottle is quite thick, even diluted by 25% requires a lot more air pressure in your airbrush to get it to spray without sputtering. This reduces control over where you want the Future to go and it also creates "dust" where there is increased air turbulence, like near wing roots and other tight spots. Here the Future is suspended in the air a bit longer and settles on the model as tiny dry particles.

I experimented quite a bit more this time with Future/Windex ratios and I now think 50% of each is the new way to go- at least for me. It sprays finer at lower air pressures, the tip doesn't clog as much and you get a more uniform finish. I've read here in this forum a few times that Windex does bad things to Future, but I've never experienced any of that. In my experience, it's just like adding paint thinner to paint.

When you spray, make sure the surface is level and horizontal. Get the surface fully wet, but not too much or it will run. Using a space heater, I can get the surface dry enough to set within 2 minutes, then I turn the model and spray another area, again with the surface horizontal. For most models, this will take maybe 6 turns to get everything even. If you have a few runs, don't worry. When the Future is dry for 10 minutes or so, you can sand the bumps off with fine sandpaper, then re-apply more Future.

Like all modeling techniques, this takes practice, practice, practice, but in no time you will feel like you are in total control of the final finish.

[adrianosouza]

Hi Guys,

Funny that I checked out this thread and found my Phantom used as an example. By coincidence, I am spraying Future right now on my A-10C build and I have a big change to how I apply Future from now on.

First of all, why Future? While other gloss coats will work just as good (or better in some cases), what I really like about Future is that I can remove it with Windex if I crash and burn and need to re-do it. A good example of a problem is if the surface was quite greasy and the Future pebbles up or if you have a lot of crap trapped within the gloss coat. A rag soaked in Windex will remove it and then you can start again.

The F-4E pic above was accomplished with a mixture of 75% Future combined with 25% Windex to dilute the Future a bit and allow it to be sprayed as a thinner coat than straight out of the bottle. This was followed by a straight coat of 100% Windex, which "re-melted" the Future and let it lay down even smoother than before.

Since Future out of the bottle is quite thick, even diluted by 25% requires a lot more air pressure in your airbrush to get it to spray without sputtering. This reduces control over where you want the Future to go and it also creates "dust" where there is increased air turbulence, like near wing roots and other tight spots. Here the Future is suspended in the air a bit longer and settles on the model as tiny dry particles.

I experimented quite a bit more this time with Future/Windex ratios and I now think 50% of each is the new way to go- at least for me. It sprays finer at lower air pressures, the tip doesn't clog as much and you get a more uniform finish. I've read here in this forum a few times that Windex does bad things to Future, but I've never experienced any of that. In my experience, it's just like adding paint thinner to paint.

When you spray, make sure the surface is level and horizontal. Get the surface fully wet, but not too much or it will run. Using a space heater, I can get the surface dry enough to set within 2 minutes, then I turn the model and spray another area, again with the surface horizontal. For most models, this will take maybe 6 turns to get everything even. If you have a few runs, don't worry. When the Future is dry for 10 minutes or so, you can sand the bumps off with fine sandpaper, then re-apply more Future.

Like all modeling techniques, this takes practice, practice, practice, but in no time you will feel like you are in total control of the final finish.

Great explanation Chuck and thanks for dropping by. Too bad i ran out of future and here in my country i can't find it, otherwise i'd give it a last trying mixing it with windex. But anyway.. Good news is that i can still persue a decent gloss with other products.. Maybe the right ratio of Mr.Color and Mr.Thinner should get me somewhere close to the "Phantom Gloss" LOL

"Like all modeling techniques, this takes practice, practice, practice, but in no time you will feel like you are in total control of the final finish"

I think i'll write that down somewhere near my bench just to look at when i go nuts with my modelling, Wise words, wise words.. LOL

[RichardL]

Maybe the right ratio of Mr.Color and Mr.Thinner should get me somewhere close to the "Phantom Gloss" LOL

Start out with a 1:1 ratio.

[adrianosouza]

Start out with a 1:1 ratio.

Oh yes, i'm gonna try 50/50 right away. :thumbsup:/> :thumbsup:/> But first i have to sort the damn camo :crying:/> :crying2:/> :blink:/>

Thanks !

[jfmajor60]

The main reason I like using is, if I screw up applying future it can be easily corrected without damaging your color coat.

[balls47]

Like the other folks said, if it gets screwed up, it's easy to remove. I apply mine straight out of the bottle with a Paasche H airbrush with the #3 needle. I spray from 3 to 4 inches, and keep moving. The Future is wet when I stay close, and I move fast enough so it won't run. I start out by doing corners (i.e. wing to fuselage joint on an F-4) After I have a decent coat in those areas, I start spraying all over the model until I have a pretty good coat. I end up putting on a thicker coat on at the end.

NOTE: I use MM enamel paint. I still haven't tried using MM Metalizer Sealer as a gloss coat. This was suggested by a friend that uses this as his gloss coat.

[Janissary]

I use future as well but I don't buy the argument that it is good because it is easy to clean up if you make a mistake. This is especially tricky if the main colors are acrylics. Anything that would help you remove future (alcohol, windex/ammonia) would invariably affect the acrylic paint too I would imagine. I tried this once and was majorly disappointed. Perhaps you can be infinitely careful and that might work, but I would still not dare removing future as such.

If the underlying color is enamel or lacquer, perhaps that could work, but that too is taking a great risk I think.

The best way to remove future, in my opinion, is very light sanding under running water, and doing this only after future has completely cured. I emphasize after curing. Best course of action is to have your main colors as smooth as possible, and apply future only after then. I agree with 50-50 future / windex combo. That's what I have been doing if I want to get a very high sheen. Nonetheless, the roughness of the main colors is the key in my opinion.

Edited April 14, 2014 by Janissary

[a4s4eva]

Up front I'll say I never mastered Future. As such I consider it the most overrated product in modelling

I much prefer Tamiya gloss thinned with Lacquer thinners. I get a much glossier finish with that combination that I ever did with future. Plus it's doesn't fill the fine detail and it's easier to clean form the airbrush than Future.

Furthermore it dries faster and harder than future and iI've found it much more impervious to enamel based weather products than future. I've sprayed and wiped off (using white sprits) enamel based weathering products 20 to 30 times on one build and the Tamiya clear wasn't bothered at all. When i used Future a couple of applications of Turps (before I found white spirits) would result in damage to the Future, white spirits should give better results but since I gave up on Future I never tried it.

And, as for being easy to remove without damaging the top coat, perhaps if you use enamels. But windex (which has ammonia in it where I live) will most certainly damage an acyclic finish

As for the cost, well after what I spend on a kit, paints, aftermarket etc and then with the time I've I think its a false economy to skimp on the gloss coat, even more so if can't get the results you want.

I'm not saying don't try it, and if you get results like Chuck then go for it.... But I think many people have got the impression that it's a must have product (I did back in the day) and that you can't get a good gloss finish with proper model paints.

Here's some Tamiya gloss finishes

The other thing to rememberer is you don't need a super shiny finish with good quality decals. Even a semi gloss will be fine if you decals are from a good printer like cartogragh.

Edited April 14, 2014 by a4s4eva

[balls47]

I guess that Future is like anything else. It works for some and not for others. There are paints, tapes, glues, etc. that work great for some folks, but I can't get them to work to save me.

- One man's poison is another man's medicine.

- One man's junk is another man's treasure.

That's enough of Balls47's "cliche festival," but I hope you all get the point.

[Just4kiks]

I don't know if this has been said yet, but Future can be a very good decal adhesive (when properly thinned of course).

I've heard that some people use it straight out of the bottle, but they have gotta be having SOME type of trouble.