Jim Barr Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 (edited) The prettier box and Hasegawa's reputation don't hurt either. Very true and if you are talking about selling kits in a hobby shop, Hasegawa wins hands down for just those reasons. In my review of 1/72 MiG-23 kits the box was one of the main things going for the Hasegawa kit . "Well the only thing I can recommend about the Hasegawa kit is that the box will fit nicely within a stack of other Hasegawa kits and it does have some very pretty artwork." I guess now I will have to add that the Hasegawa plastic has the best look and feel. Regards Jim Barr Edited November 10, 2006 by Jim Barr Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Raymond Posted November 10, 2006 Author Share Posted November 10, 2006 hiya not really 'us and them' cliche, both kits offer merrits depending on what the buyer is looking for. for a sporadic modeler of russian subjects, I woudl reccomend the hase kit as its cheap, easy to put together, and despite minor detail flaws, definatly overall captures the look of the origional well. for those with more knowlege of the mig-23 theres the zvezda kits...harder to put together...but accurate, apart from canopy and intakes, which stand out like dogs b@lls to any modeler who knows more about the 23! i found the landing gear quite basic aswell and used academy parts for them aswell as soem other parts. then for the mig-23 junkies, who want a whole family, u can use both adding the the zvezda nose and burner can to the hase model, enables u to model th earlier mig-23 varients almost OOB vs using zvezda kit and cutting and scrounging for parts. so u get the best of both worlds regards Raymond Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Barr Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 i found the landing gear quite basic aswell and used academy parts for them aswell as soem other parts. If you build 'gear up' it's no big deal. Regards Jim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 Hi Andrew, I've seen your 'MLD, and it is very nice indeed. I think you used the Zvezda radome on the Hasegawa kit? How was the fit? I have a few spare ones from my Zvezda / Italeri MiG-27 kits... Cheers, Andre My thanks for your kind words! Yes, I used the Zvezda radome on it; it looked like a close-but-not-perfect fit at first, when I both test-fit it and then attached it, but was very pleasantly surprised to find that all it needed was some good sanding. Can't even tell, now! I recently got another Zvezda ML/MLD to use for parts on another Hase, namely by using the radome, weapons pylons, AA-8's, IR unit, and several other parts. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Impatient Pete Posted November 11, 2006 Share Posted November 11, 2006 I can not address the MiG-27 issues as I have not researched that kit ( I have one but it is far down the build list) Here is the Italeri / Zvezda that as I said does have "issues" and is not an easy build, but does (to me) capture the "look" of the 23 more then the Hasegawas kit. Regards Jim Barr HOLY CRAP! Before I scrolled down to where I could see the stand, just for a moment, I assumed it was an in flight pic of the real thing. Bravo! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Barr Posted November 11, 2006 Share Posted November 11, 2006 HOLY CRAP!Before I scrolled down to where I could see the stand, just for a moment, I assumed it was an in flight pic of the real thing. Thanks indeed for the very kind words Regards Jim Barr Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bad edd Posted November 11, 2006 Share Posted November 11, 2006 (edited) My friends, i have some good news for you, an "orphaned" version of the Flogger (23 BN) will soon be released in 1/72 by......KP...the kit looks remarkably, here's a link : http://www.airplanephoto.net/mig-23bn/index.htm I love the Flogger, have built a couple of them, now working on a UB twin seater. Here are a couple of my models: An Academy (3 dollar copy of hase with reccessed panels :blink:)) : Also an academy 27 backdated to a 23BN : A zvezda MLD backdated to ML : the infamous Syrian defector: I like more the cheap academy than the zvezda, though both require a lot of work. I can hardly wait the KP kit, so we can finally have a good starting point for a decent Flogger. PS: JIM , GREAT MLD!!! Edited November 11, 2006 by bad edd Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted November 11, 2006 Share Posted November 11, 2006 Yeah, I'd love to see the KP offering, and to know what else they might have planned along similar lines. :praying: Since everyone's taking the opportunity to show their Flogger work, here's my Hasegawa/Zvezda kitbash: http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Fea1...tels/fea935.htm Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dragan_mig31 Posted November 11, 2006 Share Posted November 11, 2006 andrew this is the best folgger kit i have ever seen in any scale.when i first saw it i was in shock for 3 days Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted November 11, 2006 Share Posted November 11, 2006 *blushes* wow...I wasn't expecting a response like that...thank you!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ReiRei0 Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 (edited) Also an academy 27 backdated to a 23BN Since the KP -23BN appears to be vaporware, please tell me - what does one have to do exactly to backdate Academy's -27 to a -23BN? Also, which variants of the Flogger were used by the Cuban Air Force? Edited April 8, 2008 by ReiRei0 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChernayaAkula Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Someone with mad Photoshop skillz please cut out Jim's Flogger and post it to an appropriate back-ground. That thing is awesome! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dahut Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 (edited) Nice thread. I've enjoyed it so far. Thanks to everyone who's been in. I got the Italeri/ZVEZDA Flogger MLD a little while back for $7 and change, on sale. It strikes me much like the Hobbycraft kits I've built - they turned out nice enough and since this is supposed to be a hobby, they fit the budget accordingly. Little did I know how "bad" they were, until I read the reviews and modelers comments. Same with the I/Z Flogger. Most of the builds of these 1/72 Floggers we're discussing turn out looking alright. Some like Mr. Barr's become stellar examples of the genre. Like most of these good-bad discussions, the "bad points" end up being moot, once the paint and decals have dried. Yeah, there are a few corrections one could make to any of these kits, but even if you don't, it still looks like a MiG-23. To the scale purist, this attitude causes heartburn, but that's okay. To each his own. I do agree that, just like the SAAB Viggen, an update of the Flogger in 1/48 is sorely needed within the hobby. DO we really need yet another Mustang or F-16, when the MiG-23 fairly screams to be done up right? The MiG-23 was built in numbers exceeding 12,000, if memory serves. It was innovative, fast and highly manueverable and in skilled hands it was a very potent platform. It was intended to compete with the F-4 and F-111, so had to be good. The West had the chance to evaluate the MiG-23 early on in the 70's. Here's what was learned: "In the US, these MiG-23MS and other variants acquired later from Germany were used as part of the evaluation program of Soviet military hardware. Dutch pilot Leon Van Maurer, who had more than 1200 hours flying F-16s, flew against MiG-23ML Flogger-Gs from air bases in Germany and the U.S. as part of NATO's aerial mock combat training with Soviet equipment. He concluded the MiG-23ML was superior in the vertical to early F-16 variants, just slightly inferior to the F-16A in the horizontal, and has superior BVR capability. The Israelis tested a MiG-23MLD that defected from Syria and found it had better acceleration than the F-16 and F/A-18..." - - wikepedia Like many Russian designs, the Flogger was downplayed, only seen in hindsight to be the excellent plane it really was. As a design it was expandable and had many variants over many years of manufacture... and it went to a dizzying number of countries around the world. It should be kitted accurately and given it's place in the pantheon of the worlds great aircraft. Instead, it has remained in the scale modeling shadows. So now, as usual I've rambled. Yeah, I like the MiG-23. Thanks again for this great thread. Edited April 8, 2008 by dahut Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andre Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Since the KP -23BN appears to be vaporware, please tell me - what does one have to do exactly to backdate Academy's -27 to a -23BN? Basically, stick a MiG-27 forward fuselage to the main fuselage, GsH-23 gun, intakes and exhaust of a MiG-23 kit. Also, which variants of the Flogger were used by the Cuban Air Force? AFAIK the Fuerza Aerea Revolucionaria used the MiG-23MF, MiG-23UB and MiG-23BN. HTH, Andre Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Matt Roberts Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 WHERE'S MY NEW TOOL 48th FLOGGER!!! I suggest we use this whenever a new Hasegawa 48th kit is announced, no matter if it is a new Draken or a decals only rebox of a Tomcat! IT WORKED FOR THE SCOOTER PEOPLE! Matt P.S. The Rumormonger has picked up no rumors of a new tool Flogger out there other than the 32nd Trumpeter resin prototype a couple of years ago. Great thread by the way Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pollie Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Basically, stick a MiG-27 forward fuselage to the main fuselage, GsH-23 gun, intakes and exhaust of a MiG-23 kit. AFAIK the Fuerza Aerea Revolucionaria used the MiG-23MF, MiG-23UB and MiG-23BN. HTH, Andre MiG-23ML too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ReiRei0 Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 So, reviewing all these variants, all these Ms, MLs, MFs, MLDs, and MoFos, all in all, which kit would I want to get to model a Cuban Flogger? Thanks all for guiding me through the dark forest of arcane versions. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ReiRei0 Posted April 8, 2008 Share Posted April 8, 2008 Also, as long as we're discussing Floggers: What colors should be used in the cockpit? Also, what is the light gray color that has recently been applied to Indian MiG-27s? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
David Walker Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 The cockpit should be the torquoise-green color. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lulldapull Posted April 12, 2008 Share Posted April 12, 2008 I can not address the MiG-27 issues as I have not researched that kit ( I have one but it is far down the build list) Here is the Italeri / Zvezda that as I said does have "issues" and is not an easy build, but does (to me) capture the "look" of the 23 more then the Hasegawas kit. Regards Jim Barr Jim, that is one hell of a nice looking Flogger! B) Just gorgeous! ;) I take it you re cribed the whole beast? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Barr Posted April 12, 2008 Share Posted April 12, 2008 Thanks for the kind words. Yes I did re-scribe the panel lines Regards Jim Barr Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dahut Posted April 13, 2008 Share Posted April 13, 2008 So, reviewing all these variants, all these Ms, MLs, MFs, MLDs, and MoFos, all in all, which kit would I want to get to model a Cuban Flogger? MoFo's - hha! Funny!! Wings Palette has a number of Cuban Mig 23's the majority of which are "B's" in the single seat bersion. SO the Hasegawa kit seems to be the one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vrsa Posted April 13, 2008 Share Posted April 13, 2008 As long as we are on the subject of Flogers, does somebody know what are the corect dimensions & what do they actually include. I have several sources & they dont match. The problem is in lenght mostly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Berkut Posted April 13, 2008 Share Posted April 13, 2008 Thanks for the kind words. Yes I did re-scribe the panel linesRegards Jim Barr What decals did you use? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted April 13, 2008 Share Posted April 13, 2008 Jim, that is one hell of a nice looking Flogger! Just gorgeous! I take it you re cribed the whole beast? I have to add my compliments as well. That is just an awesome model. The paint is perfect and even the pilot looks realistic. I know it sounds cliche but when I first looked the pix quickly, I thought it was an in-flight photo of the real thing. Regards, John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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