Marcel111 Posted January 4, 2009 Author Share Posted January 4, 2009 Ken, Brendon, thx for the pics... always worth a thousand words. JMC, thx for the insight, I think I'm seeing the light. FYI, I shot some Al on the leading edges etc., will follow that up with pale yellow tomorrow (I'm building a SJ 2003 airplane and the primer seems to have still been yellow back then). Marcel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
C-130CrewChief Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I was stationed at Elmendof for a few years (2001-2005) and I saw F-15s being painted with yellow Epoxy primer on more than one occasion down at the old paint barn. I think every USAF aircraft has more Epoxy primer on it than paint if you weigh it out. That being said I am by far not an expert on F-15s I just have the Avation junkie syndrome and a case of "interesting diorama look out". I can say from 12 years of C-130 expertise that every piece of metal on it has a liberal coat of the yellow stuff if it's not the original zinkchromite green. I also want to say....I love all of you, and I thank you for all the interesting things I learn from you. That was the junkie in me speeking. Curt Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ElectroSoldier Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 Ask Chemsol for the FS number of the yellow primer, they make it so they will know. sales@chemsol.com To add a little, being a epoxy resin, the surface would need to be abraded for the primer to key, the bare metal/composite surfaces would need to be sanded in order to be painted, like F-15CrewCheif said, that means anything applied during construction [protective paints for instance] would need to be removed, usually be sanding or sand blasting in order to remove unwanted materials and provide a keyed surface for the primer. Epoxys have an ability to part company with any surface not prepaird quite spercifically for it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ken Middleton Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 You are welcome. You should have seen my poor piggie before her paint job-more primer green than anything else! I hear she is at Eglin now.JMC would that be 87-0180? I guess the stuff's not good for you if you eat enough of it. :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Deon Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 This isn't relevant to US stuff no doubt, but I used to spray a brownish translucent chemical on to aircraft before priming, rather than abrading the exposed metal, maybe it was some sort of etching primer or similar, that was after having removed all the paint with stripper (on metal only) and a bit of scotch brite where the primer still adhered like around rivets etc. Perhaps someone with a bewtter memory than me knows what I was doing, g@d knows I didn't! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle21 Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 would that be 87-0180? :P :D Yep, back before she was the wing commanders bird. That happened after I left Edwards. She was always good for a Code-2 flight, usually not hard broke, but normally something to keep occupied with. JMC Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ken Middleton Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Yep, back before she was the wing commanders bird. That happened after I left Edwards. She was always good for a Code-2 flight, usually not hard broke, but normally something to keep occupied with.JMC always interesting to hear the history on certain airframes - thanks Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle21 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 always interesting to hear the history on certain airframes - thanks When I was there we mostly did some radar tests and engine tests. Other odds and ends to keep busy, there was always something going on. 86-0183 (the first E-model) got the cool spin tests. JMC Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ol Crew Dog Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The priming as everyone has said is part of corrosion control, but yes it is is done spot paint but it is done. Just a reminder of my background. Worked every type of F-15 from A through S as a Crew Dawg, Engines, Haydraulics, and Crash Recovery. A and B's at Langley, C, D and E's at Kadena, Elmendorf and Lakenheath, I and S models for Delivery and J models while I was on echange with the JASDF. I am retired now and working for a Major Aerospace Company as a Program Manager. Why he went off in a snit I have no idea but If you need any questions answered about the F-15 there are plenty on here that have worked them or flew them. Cheers Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GoBlue96 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The only time an F-15 has primer under the paint is when the jet rolls of the assembly line or you get a new part for the airframe. When the jet gets painted at homestation, the paint bard just scuff's up the airframe with rotory sanders. At depot, they bead blast the thing to bare metal and then paint.Just something to think about. Your kit. Not to pile on here or anything, but as a design engineer on a newer fighter aircraft program, there's so much about this post that just makes me shudder. "Scuff up the airframe with rotary sanders"??? Holy hell, are you serious? No primer under the paint? Wow, just... wow. My M&P guys would kill me and then consume my soul if I were to suggest such a thing as part of an engineering design. And yeah, no more chromated primer for new deliveries. We switched over to the non-chromated stuff a few years ago. The new stuff has a funky blue-ish green color that nobody seems to like too much. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle21 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Not to pile on here or anything, but as a design engineer on a newer fighter aircraft program, there's so much about this post that just makes me shudder. "Scuff up the airframe with rotary sanders"??? Holy hell, are you serious? No primer under the paint? Wow, just... wow. My M&P guys would kill me and then consume my soul if I were to suggest such a thing as part of an engineering design. And yeah, no more chromated primer for new deliveries. We switched over to the non-chromated stuff a few years ago. The new stuff has a funky blue-ish green color that nobody seems to like too much. It's not like you grind it down into metal dust! Done properly, you are just removing the old paint until you barely see the primer underneath and then stop. The paint barn guys scream bloody murder if you actually go all the way to the metal, because then you are damaging the metal. And i am only talking about how it is done on an F-15, I haven't got a clue how they do it on other fighter aircraft. We also didn't think about coming near any of the composite surfaces that are on the jet, again the paint barn (read: structural maintenance) guys would threaten to cut our hands off, repairing composites is a pain. A long time ago when I used to work at Love Field (as a lineman at Associated Air Center) the paint shop there used some really nasty, un-eco-friendly, goopy paint solvent to remove the paint on airliners (727s and 737s mostly then). It was goopy yellow that smelled terrible and basically burned your skin if you looked at it. I tried to avoid the paint barn on those days! JMC Quote Link to post Share on other sites
volzj Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 It's nice to see rational, level headed discussion from adults about this topic. Thanks to those who contributed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
richter111 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 I had not even realized the paint chipped on these birds, thanks for pointing it out, like I said, sometimes the obvious walks right past us... Now where did I put my kosher salt???? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ElectroSoldier Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 This isn't relevant to US stuff no doubt, but I used to spray a brownish translucent chemical on to aircraft before priming, rather than abrading the exposed metal, maybe it was some sort of etching primer or similar, that was after having removed all the paint with stripper (on metal only) and a bit of scotch brite where the primer still adhered like around rivets etc. Perhaps someone with a bewtter memory than me knows what I was doing, g@d knows I didn't! Abrading for epoxys can be as simple as a piece of scotch brite on a shiney surface, if the suface is soft enough to be keyed with a scotch brite pad of course Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimz66 Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Silly question about the F-15's and other Air Force AC. While on the beginning of this thread I notice the outlines around the insertion points for the external refueling. What are the lines in front of them for, a target for the folks inside the tankers? I always thought it was the pilots who had to line up to the tanker not the other way around. Did I miss something? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jmel Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 I always thought it was the pilots who had to line up to the tanker not the other way around. Did I miss something? It's the other way around. The pilot flies formation with the tanker using lights on the bottom of the tanker as a guide. Once in position, the boomer then "flies" the boom into the receptacle using the little wings on the boom to steer it. Jake Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fasteagle12 Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Silly question about the F-15's and other Air Force AC. While on the beginning of this thread I notice the outlines around the insertion points for the external refueling. What are the lines in front of them for, a target for the folks inside the tankers? I always thought it was the pilots who had to line up to the tanker not the other way around. Did I miss something? Navy aviators flys into a basket attached to a hose...AF gets into the right position and the boom operator flys the fuel nozzle into the plane. The 'lines' are for him to use to line up the boom probe as he plugs in. This is needed mostly for night refueling. I'm no expert and I'm sure there are others that have a lot more details, but from what I know, this is the case and use for the formation markings. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ken Middleton Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Silly question about the F-15's and other Air Force AC. While on the beginning of this thread I notice the outlines around the insertion points for the external refueling. What are the lines in front of them for, a target for the folks inside the tankers? I always thought it was the pilots who had to line up to the tanker not the other way around. Did I miss something? Jim, the lines are present on F-16s. A-10s, B-52s etc as well Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimz66 Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Thanks fellas that clear things up a lot. Now I think I understand. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aussie_superbug Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 It's not like you grind it down into metal dust! Done properly, you are just removing the old paint until you barely see the primer underneath and then stop. The paint barn guys scream bloody murder if you actually go all the way to the metal, because then you are damaging the metal. And i am only talking about how it is done on an F-15, I haven't got a clue how they do it on other fighter aircraft. We also didn't think about coming near any of the composite surfaces that are on the jet, again the paint barn (read: structural maintenance) guys would threaten to cut our hands off, repairing composites is a pain.A long time ago when I used to work at Love Field (as a lineman at Associated Air Center) the paint shop there used some really nasty, un-eco-friendly, goopy paint solvent to remove the paint on airliners (727s and 737s mostly then). It was goopy yellow that smelled terrible and basically burned your skin if you looked at it. I tried to avoid the paint barn on those days! JMC that wouldn't be Turco 3351 paint stripper now?.... you're right just looking at it burns. I work for Boeing Australia, as a painter, so we get both metallic and composite components, we use orbital sanders on both, but when it comes to the composite structures, we are careful on how we sand them, usually the around the repair is scuffed back by the other guys, we feather the area around the repair, scuff it down, Alodine any bare metal areas( if required), prime and topcoat IAW the manual /work instruction of the particular part that you're working on. On the RAAF F/A-18's we use MMS-423, it's a Waterborne Primer which is a Green-grey colour. Brendon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle21 Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 that wouldn't be Turco 3351 paint stripper now?.... you're right just looking at it burns. I work for Boeing Australia, as a painter, so we get both metallic and composite components, we use orbital sanders on both, but when it comes to the composite structures, we are careful on how we sand them, usually the around the repair is scuffed back by the other guys, we feather the area around the repair, scuff it down, Alodine any bare metal areas( if required), prime and topcoat IAW the manual /work instruction of the particular part that you're working on. On the RAAF F/A-18's we use MMS-423, it's a Waterborne Primer which is a Green-grey colour. Brendon Oh, I can't remember the type, that was about 22 years ago. I was a simple lineman, charged with moving the planes around and putting gas into them. JMC Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wayne S Posted February 18, 2009 Share Posted February 18, 2009 Strange to see the green epoxy on the F-15E, all other aircraft that I have seen have the yellow epoxy. Has this been seen on all F-15Es? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.