Well Hasegawa you are about to lose another customer!!

[Wayne S]

The day static models cost the same as R/C is the day I stop building statics. Could put my skills into making doll and bird houses if and when that happens.

[Aussie_superbug]

Hi Guys

well I got an email form one of my LHS with this remark:

I am not sure what is going on with Hasegawa and their pricing!!! It would lead you to believe that they are not really serious about staying in the model kit industry. A prime example is the kit below H07247 1/48 A-7D/E Corsair, a kit which is well over 15 years old. Based on the price quoted to us, we have to price it at $81.00 when you can get the HobbyBoss kit for $57.00! and you get all the weapons too! and just look at the price for the FW190A5/U-14 $110.00!!!! STUPID! 1/72 AIRCRAFT

H01563JUNKERS Ju188A/E$77.00

H01564F-16I FIGHTING FALCON "ISRAELI AIR FORCE"$51 .00

1/72 AIRCRAFT LIMITED EDITION

H00997MITSUBISHI A6M2b/A6M3 ZERO FIGHTER $51 .00

TYPE 21/22 "201ST FLYING GROUP COMBO" (Two kits in the box)

H00998KUGISHO P1Y1-S GINGA (FRANCES) $59.5 0

TYPE 11 "NIGHT FIGHTER"

1/48 AIRCRAFT

H07247A-7D/E CORSAIR II$81.00

1/32 AIRCRAFT

H08204KITTYHAWK Mk.I/Mk.III$89.50

1/48 "LIMITED EDITION" AIRCRAFT

H09910J35J DRAKEN "SWEDISH SPECIAL"$68 .00

H09911 FOCKE-WULF Fw190A-5/U14 w/TORPEDO $110.5 0

1/200 AIRLINERS

H10672ANA B727-200 (Two kits in the box)$47.00

All these prices are $AUD, but still i cant believe they're asking that sort of price on a kit that all they have done to it is put a new set of decals.

Brendon

[ventura_kelley]

The day static models cost the same as R/C is the day I stop building statics. Could put my skills into making doll and bird houses if and when that happens.

Already here. I've got a good quality RC helicopter that came with everything I need brand new for $129 from my LHS.

It's now on sale for $99:

http://www.e-fliterc.com/Products/Default....ProdID=EFLH2200

And once you have that, you get the BNF MSR (Bind aNd Fly, uses the transmitter - black box with the sticks - from the MCX above) for $129.

http://www.e-fliterc.com/Products/Default....ProdID=EFLH3080

And both of them are roughly (very roughly) the same size as a 1/48th scale Huey, so you can cruise them around your living room.

So two fully functional radio controlled helicopters with everything you need to fly, including the batteries and radio, for less than the price of two 1/48th scale Hasegawa Sea Kings from Squadron (ON SALE, I might add).

[Mackie]

I scanned thru the threads so I hope I'm not repeating...

If Hasegawa / Tamiya / etc. are going to keep bumping up their prices they could at least give us:

- Photoetched seatbelts

- Positionable canopies

- Usable decals

- Positionable control surfaces

- A little more thought where the ejector pin marks are going to be!!! Especially if you're gonna make a clear edition / skeleton kit! Seriously guys!!

- No offense to servicemen I've never heard of, I appreciate your sacrifice, but if I'm buying a kit of a Corsair could ya' throw in a set of Pappy Boyington decals, please?!?

--------------

Tamiya is in the habit of tossing in a couple jerry cans and a figure and charging 40% the original price. Hasegawa is a decal company. At least with Eduard you don't get all the aforementioned gripes ^ but their prices are starting to inch (yard) up, too!

20 years from now, when we're all long gone, the hobby is not going to exist because nobody is really marketing to the kids these days.

Tell you what, the 1/48 ARII P-47 is a pretty darn nice kit. It needs all the usual attention but if I'm gonna buy all the after market stuff anyway (see aforementioned gripes) an $8 donor kit is much better than a $40-50 one!

2cents

[madmike]

There has to be low dollar kits made like they used to make when we were kids. Just saying....

There are.

Hobby Boss 1:72 kits. The juniors that come to the weekly club workshops at both our club and a local hobby store build a good deal of these kits as they retail here for under AU$10 each. (That's about equivalent to the price I used to pay for 1:72 Airfix and Matchbox kits 25+ years ago).

These kits are easy to build and look great once finished.

Back those days I had to save my pocket money far longer for the more expensive Revell and Monogram kits or hope that they were under the Christmas tree.

[KenM]

Yea, Typhoon.

I know one of their ex-employees, and they typically got models for 15-20% less than MSRP, and if they buy in volume, even less.

US store and there's no sales tax here.

ONE kit won't pay their light bill, but hundreds of kits will, so they need move a volume of inventory every month.

And the longer a kit sits on the shelf, the more it costs them, which is why you want the marked price to be as close to the ultimate sale price as possible. You mark it too low, and sure it's out the door fast, but you've lost money because someone probably would have paid more.

You mark it too high, and it doesn't move, creating inventory, which costs money. Every square foot of shelf space has a value based on the rent you're paying for the property. Plus the heating bill, plus the electricity bill, plus the water bill, plus the taxes you pay on your inventory, plus the cost of the employees to clean/organize/maintain the inventory and those costs add up day after day.

The problem is the shop thinks they can sell that kit for $49 because it has colorful markings (invasion stripes), but because they went so far overboard it has been sitting there for 18 months collecting costs. So now they probably have $49 (or more) invested in it and it will never be worth that because I can buy it brand spanking new for $20 through the secondary market.

They need to redo the price to what it should have been the day it hit the shelves ($34), and cut their losses.

Because in another 18 months, they might have $60 invested in it, and $75 18 months from that, and $90 18 months after that.

Excellent points, is that Typhoon kit this one http://www.dragonmodelsusa.com/dmlusa/prodd.asp?pid=HAS09862 one of those stupid "Limited Edtion" kits that is just an assortment of other kit sprues, because the prices on those at the distributor level are about $30 and if you use the same markup formula presto you get your $45 plus retail . If they were resin bits I could see it but not for just plastic.

Ken

[LanceB]

Yeah, well you know the reissue of the Revell 1/72 Space Shuttle was just announced over here in Japan. Converted to USD it works out to almost $180 (16,800 yen MSRP). :P

What the heck is Revell thinking!

[PNW_Modeler]

The day static models cost the same as R/C is the day I stop building statics. Could put my skills into making doll and bird houses if and when that happens.

So I guess that means you are done building static models?

[Abakan]

Yeah, well you know the reissue of the Revell 1/72 Space Shuttle was just announced over here in Japan. Converted to USD it works out to almost $180 (16,800 yen MSRP). :)

What the heck is Revell thinking!

I noticed that too. Very high prices for european kits. I guess they have the same problem we do :(

[jbrundt]

Yeah, well you know the reissue of the Revell 1/72 Space Shuttle was just announced over here in Japan. Converted to USD it works out to almost $180 (16,800 yen MSRP).

What the heck is Revell thinking!

It makes no sense as the dollar is so low that US kits should be a bargain in overseas markets.

[ventura_kelley]

It makes no sense as the dollar is so low that US kits should be a bargain in overseas markets.

Unless they're being charged huge licensing fees.

Or plastic/oil is really really expensive again. Can't be oil. That's only gone up $10 per barrel.

So it's probably either the cost of plastic or licensing fees.

[ChernayaAkula]

The cost of raw plastic is only a few cents per kit. So any flexes in oil prices are much more likely to affect shipping costs than the actual cost of producing a kit.

Edited April 6, 2010 by ChernayaAkula

[TXCajun]

Per Mike's OP:

I seriously think it is a typo. I love to get the Squadron sale flyers, but I find that there are typos in just about every issue I get. For clarification, I go to the web site, punch in the stock number, and see what it says. If the price is still in question, give 'em a call. In the US, it is toll free. Or, just drop Mackie an e-mail.

At the same time, I am finding that I am purchasing fewer and fewer models retail... and yes, I am also thankful that I have a decent stash.

Now, you want a rant? How about the price of Testor's Model Master enamels? My LHS sells them for $3.30 per 1/4oz jar! That's = $850 a gallon!

That makes about as much sense as paying $3.00 for common tap water in a blow-molded plastic non-biodegradable bottle. NO one would EVER buy something like that!!!

Stew

[niart17]

That makes about as much sense as paying $3.00 for common tap water in a blow-molded plastic non-biodegradable bottle. NO one would EVER buy something like that!!!

Stew

Water in a bottle!?!?! Where can I find that? I'll order a whole case of it. But only if it comes in small bottles with a pull top cap that doesn't really work. ;)

Bill

[TXCajun]

Water in a bottle!?!?! Where can I find that? I'll order a whole case of it. But only if it comes in small bottles with a pull top cap that doesn't really work. ;)

Bill

I think I have something like that in the pantry, brother! I should put it on E-Bay, shouldn't I!? I'm thinking of marketing it as "Stew's Wonder Decal Glue Solvent" I could charge $10 a bottle! Modelers could pour it into a bowl, heat it up for a couple of seconds in the microwave, and place decals into it for about 20 seconds before attempting to slide said decals off the backing paper and onto their models!

Genius!

Stew

(3:17)!

Sorry, didn't mean to threadjack. Just trying to bring some levity into play.

[ventura_kelley]

Excellent points, is that Typhoon kit this one http://www.dragonmodelsusa.com/dmlusa/prodd.asp?pid=HAS09862 one of those stupid "Limited Edtion" kits that is just an assortment of other kit sprues, because the prices on those at the distributor level are about $30 and if you use the same markup formula presto you get your $45 plus retail . If they were resin bits I could see it but not for just plastic.

Ken ;)

Yea, I think that might be it.

Here it is on HLJ http://www.hlj.com/product/HSG09862

And their price is: ¥2,800 About USD $29.80; €22.28

Plus about $10 worth of shipping.

But that's throwing the thing in a box and flying it here. The distributors pay pennies for their shipping because they load thousands of these things at a time into a container and put it on a boat.

Not to mention the fact that the distributors aren't paying the Japanese hobbyshop price of ¥2,800. Remember that's the shelf price, not the distributor price.

[twhite80]

Well I don't think that there is an organized conspiracy to hike plastic model kit rates. I suffer 'sticker shock' every time a new kit comes out too. But I really can't think of a hobby or commodity where the quality has gone up and the price has gone down. Even things where the quality has stayed the same prices continue to climb. Everything, and I mean everything from tomatoes, to movies, to fan belts are more expensive today than they were 5 or 10 years ago. When I was a kid I bought a pack of baseball cards for about $1, today you have to pay triple that or more just for the basic cards. And today the cards don't even come with that crappy dissolve-in-your-mouth gum. Stuff is just more expensive. I think what drives us nuts is that we go buy a Hasegawa F-14 lets say and it used to be $40 for the kit, now it is $80 and it is frustrating because we remember when they used to be 'cheap.'

[IrishGreek]

Unless they're being charged huge licensing fees.

Or plastic/oil is really really expensive again. Can't be oil. That's only gone up $10 per barrel.

So it's probably either the cost of plastic or licensing fees.

Could some of the countries also be charging duties on imports, also driving up costs? It might even be happening here. Don't get to keep up with politics that much, but I know folks have been tossing around protectionist stuff in congress on and off...

[Big Texan]

There are.

Hobby Boss 1:72 kits. The juniors that come to the weekly club workshops at both our club and a local hobby store build a good deal of these kits as they retail here for under AU$10 each. (That's about equivalent to the price I used to pay for 1:72 Airfix and Matchbox kits 25+ years ago).

These kits are easy to build and look great once finished.

Back those days I had to save my pocket money far longer for the more expensive Revell and Monogram kits or hope that they were under the Christmas tree.

Look where you live. I'm sure Hobby Boss kits are cheaper there then here in the U.S. Monogram and Revell were cheaper than Matchbox, etc., during the day here in the U.S. Therefore, were back at distribution. That seems to be the key in this whole discussion over kit pricing. So, how do we modelers impress on distributors or the model manufacturers to put pressure on them? Can we even do something like this in our capacity?

[madmanrick]

So, how do we modelers impress on distributors or the model manufacturers to put pressure on them? Can we even do something like this in our capacity?

Of course you can, it is called "voting with your wallet." If enough people decided that they've had it with the abnormally high rates at which model kits have risen in price, they can simply boycott them. However, this may have the intended effect, as well an unintended effect. The intended effect would be to convince the model manufacturers that the limit has been reached and they need to look at doing things to keep their prices from rising quite so fast. The unintended effect could be that some of those manufacturers decide to quit selling models altogether, as that is easier than trying to keep costs down.

[JeskiM]

Well I don't think that there is an organized conspiracy to hike plastic model kit rates. I suffer 'sticker shock' every time a new kit comes out too. But I really can't think of a hobby or commodity where the quality has gone up and the price has gone down. Even things where the quality has stayed the same prices continue to climb. Everything, and I mean everything from tomatoes, to movies, to fan belts are more expensive today than they were 5 or 10 years ago. When I was a kid I bought a pack of baseball cards for about $1, today you have to pay triple that or more just for the basic cards. And today the cards don't even come with that crappy dissolve-in-your-mouth gum. Stuff is just more expensive. I think what drives us nuts is that we go buy a Hasegawa F-14 lets say and it used to be $40 for the kit, now it is $80 and it is frustrating because we remember when they used to be 'cheap.'

I can think of only one thing that * quality * has gone up and prices down/same.

Computers and TVs

I got a 52'' Pioneer Projector TV 8 years ago for ~ $2,000 .... now I can get a far better LCD or LED of the same size for about the same price...same with computers; more power, etc for roughly the same/lower costs compared to a few years ago.

Everything else seems to go up in prices....including funerals !!!

- Matt

[Big Texan]

Of course you can, it is called "voting with your wallet." If enough people decided that they've had it with the abnormally high rates at which model kits have risen in price, they can simply boycott them. However, this may have the intended effect, as well an unintended effect. The intended effect would be to convince the model manufacturers that the limit has been reached and they need to look at doing things to keep their prices from rising quite so fast. The unintended effect could be that some of those manufacturers decide to quit selling models altogether, as that is easier than trying to keep costs down.

I agree whole heartedly in what you're saying. Maybe a possible solution would be the Presidents of the various IPMS societies around the world write a collective letter stressing to both maunfacturer and distributor that prices are too high. They could threaten boycotts, but that wouldn't be appropriate in the first letter. Give them a chance to respond. If they don't or its negative, then some kind of boycott could go into effect. That being said, boycotts aren't always successful.

[madmanrick]

I can think of only one thing that * quality * has gone up and prices down/same.

Computers and TVs

I got a 52'' Pioneer Projector TV 8 years ago for ~ $2,000 .... now I can get a far better LCD or LED of the same size for about the same price...same with computers; more power, etc for roughly the same/lower costs compared to a few years ago.

Everything else seems to go up in prices....including funerals !!!

- Matt

The difference in the electronics business is that they are continually bringing new products to the market and charging a steep premium for said product, also since the market for consumer electronics is so large they have many factories producing say LCD screens. As the new product comes on the scene you (the consumer) pays a premium to buy the latest one, however the older models are discounted to move them. When LCD's first came on the scene, there was exactly ONE plant making them, so they were very expensive (classic supply & demand theory at work). However, many more plants have come on line to make LCD's and the price has fallen, to the point that an LCD TV is about the same price as an old tube TV was. The same theory is at work in the computer/cellphone industry as well.

[madmike]

Look where you live. I'm sure Hobby Boss kits are cheaper there then here in the U.S. Monogram and Revell were cheaper than Matchbox, etc., during the day here in the U.S. Therefore, were back at distribution. That seems to be the key in this whole discussion over kit pricing. So, how do we modelers impress on distributors or the model manufacturers to put pressure on them? Can we even do something like this in our capacity?

You will find the Hobby Boss range of 1:72 kits cheap pretty much anywhere. I believe you can get them in the US for around US$9.

http://www.ipmsusa2.org/reviews/Kits/Aircr...ss_72_dora9.htm

This is why I mention why they are great starter kits for kids and thus popular with both them and senior modellers alike, just as the Airfix/Matchbox kits were or in your case cheap Revell/Monogram kits were before real world pricing arrived.

Here, Tamiya, Hasegawa and Dragon kits have always been expensive. Trumpeter is a cheaper alternative but not by much. The new 1:32 F-14D retails for over AU$200. I paid AU$175 for the 1:32 SU-27 Flanker some 2 years or so ago as well.

You cannot solely blame the distributors either. Hasegawa routinely rebox 20 year old kits with new decals and whack on a hefty new base price.

New kits are more detailed, have more parts and include resin, etch and white metal. They are not the more simple kits of years ago that were produced in far more higher numbers keeping costs down and thus making the product cheaper.

Unfortunately, we, the modeller, caused this by demanding more....more parts, more detail, more accuracy and more options. The price hike is a natural consequence of this.

Edited April 6, 2010 by madmike

[catcow1234]

Looking at all the last posts it seems like a case of everyone squeezing maximum profits out of a kit (manufacturer, importer, reseller, etc...). It may only be a couple of £ or $ at each stage but by the time it gets to us, the buyer, the price is just too much. That would explain why we can import them direct to our door and still manage to save a small fortune on many kits.