Jonathan_Lotton Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 1 hour ago, Ventris said: So did they go keel up already or are they still butthurt because they got called out on the Tomcat errors? I dunno...normally companies that go belly up at least make an announcement that they're done, the standard "we appreciate all of you but due to circumstances beyond our control.." etc. I think either more errors came up, and the cost to fix them would have outweighed the return on the kit now that the Tamiya D is out there and GWH is not far behind probably and have just elected to stay quiet because they don't know how to handle this. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madmanrick Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 49 minutes ago, Jonathan_Lotton said: I think either more errors came up, and the cost to fix them would have outweighed the return on the kit now that the Tamiya D is out there and GWH is not far behind probably and have just elected to stay quiet because they don't know how to handle this. And pray tell, what "evidence" do you have to support this? Or are you simply talking out your butt cheeks? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
A-10 LOADER Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Lesson learned the hard way I guess, keep your mouth shut until your ready to produce. Steve Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jonathan_Lotton Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 37 minutes ago, madmanrick said: And pray tell, what "evidence" do you have to support this? Or are you simply talking out your butt cheeks? I don't have any. All I know is that I made a commitment to buy two of the damn things and so far they said it was coming out in the summer of 2018, then there were "unavoidable delays" and then they went quiet totally and have ignored their customers and potential customers. So either they're incompetent or out of business, either way they should disclose what is going on. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Piker38 Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 13 minutes ago, Jonathan_Lotton said: I don't have any. All I know is that I made a commitment to buy two of the damn things and so far they said it was coming out in the summer of 2018, then there were "unavoidable delays" and then they went quiet totally and have ignored their customers and potential customers. So either they're incompetent or out of business, either way they should disclose what is going on. Have you paid any money yet ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jonathan_Lotton Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 25 minutes ago, Piker38 said: Have you paid any money yet ? No, but that really shouldn't matter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Piker38 Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 40 minutes ago, Jonathan_Lotton said: No, but that really shouldn't matter. So, you promised to buy one when available............ and they promised to produce an accurate F-14D, which is taking longer than they expected............. End of. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jonathan_Lotton Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 27 minutes ago, Piker38 said: So, you promised to buy one when available............ and they promised to produce an accurate F-14D, which is taking longer than they expected............. End of. Right...so..me wanting an explanation as to what is taking so long, or if the company is going to continue to produce the kit at all...I should just kind of..accept it? Whatever you say chav Quote Link to post Share on other sites
goondman Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 4 hours ago, Piker38 said: Have you paid any money yet ? Incidentally, there are some that have paid already. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mstor Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 5 hours ago, A-10 LOADER said: Lesson learned the hard way I guess, keep your mouth shut until your ready to produce. Steve That's a good idea if you are completely confident in your research and that your molds are accurate. Might work for a company like Tamiya that has the money and resources to properly research their subjects. Look at Modelcollect's B-52 kits. Their initial releases were rife with problems and they had to redesign much of their work. They are listening to their customers though and have garnered praise for their responsiveness in correcting the issues. In AMK's case, they seemed to be soliciting advise from subject matter experts and the forums. What we saw of the CAD seemed OK but somehow when it came to making the molds, they had problems. I don't know where they went wrong. For a long time they denied that there were problems. But, their last post on Facebook, back in November, stated they were on the 4th iteration of their molds and felt that they were on the right track in correcting issues, that they should be in production soon. After that, nothing. I feel bad for them in a way. They have produced some good kits. They listened to their customers when it came to the Kfir kit problems (though that is an example of a costly mistake that could have been avoided). Obviously they feel that total silence is their best route for now. For what reason, we don't know. I personally wish they would let us know what has happened to cause this delay, if the project is still even on. But, they keep their own counsel. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 13 hours ago, A-10 LOADER said: Lesson learned the hard way I guess, keep your mouth shut until your ready to produce. Steve In the age of Internet and social networks, a company can not keep it mouth shut until the product is released. Tamiya themselves don't do that, they made plenty of promotion before the actual presentation and later release of the diverses Tomcat birds and others kits. Problem with AMK isn't secrecy, it's mistruth. They plain and simple lied numerous times here and on their different FB pages, were caught and exposed. Normally, in this case of scenario, companies used to change name, logo and executive staff to help customers forget. We'll see. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doppelgänger Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 8 hours ago, Mstor said: Obviously they feel that total silence is their best route for now. For what reason, we don't know. Mark, I think AMK might have finally chosen to do as Steve suggested: keep their mouths shut until they're ready to produce. Unfortunately, it's the worst thing to do now, after they've asked for the assistance of those subject matter experts on this forum (and also, having asked for pre-ordering to a certain number of customers). I still remember Martin stating that the fat-arse on the model was owing to an optical illusion... That's totally unacceptable. 20 minutes ago, shion said: Tamiya themselves don't do that, they made plenty of promotion before the actual presentation and later release of the diverses Tomcat birds and others kits. I think Tamiya promotes their kits once they're almost ready to be released, which is what most manufacturers do. 23 minutes ago, shion said: Problem with AMK isn't secrecy, it's mistruth. They plain and simple lied numerous times here and on their different FB pages, were caught and exposed. Agreed. And the Tomcat D was not the only kit they've lied about. It's the SuE, the Foxbat, etc. Cheers, Onigiri Quote Link to post Share on other sites
adamitri Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 10 hours ago, goondman said: Incidentally, there are some that have paid already. And got the run around trying to get it refunded.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mstor Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Doppelgänger said: I think Tamiya promotes their kits once they're almost ready to be released, which is what most manufacturers do. Yes, like I said, Tamiya can get away with this because their resources and research are amazing. They sit at the top of the scale model food chain. Other model companies do communicate this way too. Often their kits will have problems and the companies usually just let the aftermarket deal with it and take their chances. They don't have the money or will to go back and retool once the kit was released, but they also didn't spend months and months touting their kit as the best "fill in subject of choice" kit in the world. AMK did and now they're in a bind. If they're to keep to their word they have to retool. And that's where we are now, we think. On some nth iteration of their tooling for the "best" F-14D kit every made. The costs to them have got to be high. Who knows, the delays may be due to cash flow problems, no money for new tools. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
playertwo Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 I think there are a few of us in here that pre-ordered (paid) for the kit from Sincere Hobby. I heard there was an issue getting a reply from them, so I tried and got no response as well. Paypal dispute/claim is only good for 180 days and it's been WAY longer than that. What sort of (legal) action can I take? I was going to wait it out to see what happens, but I want a refund now too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ventris Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 30 minutes ago, playertwo said: I think there are a few of us in here that pre-ordered (paid) for the kit from Sincere Hobby. I heard there was an issue getting a reply from them, so I tried and got no response as well. Paypal dispute/claim is only good for 180 days and it's been WAY longer than that. What sort of (legal) action can I take? I was going to wait it out to see what happens, but I want a refund now too. Iam pretty sure any legal action will be more expensive than what you paid for your pre-order. Write the money off, dont buy AMK again and learn from this to NEVER pre-order anything except it is a 100% reliable company. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madmanrick Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 Well I have paid money, as I pre-ordered two from Sincere Hobby on the first go-round (to the tune of $100+) and I have three pre-ordered from Victory, with no money out of pocket. Despite doing that I haven't gotten my panties in a bunch over the delays and my kits will come when they come. In fact, I am much more concerned over when the Turd may let the hard-working government employees return to serving the American people and return to earning an honest living. Ironic how a dose of "reality" can force things into perspective? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madmanrick Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, playertwo said: I think there are a few of us in here that pre-ordered (paid) for the kit from Sincere Hobby. I heard there was an issue getting a reply from them, so I tried and got no response as well. Paypal dispute/claim is only good for 180 days and it's been WAY longer than that. What sort of (legal) action can I take? I was going to wait it out to see what happens, but I want a refund now too. If you paid with a credit card through Paypal you may be able to contact the card company and do a charge back. However, it may be too late for even that at this point. If anyone is truly concerned about it, they could at least investigate that route. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madmanrick Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Ventris said: a 100% reliable company. An oxymoron if I ever heard one. Name one company that is not in business to make money and perhaps you are closer to your chimera. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
terrysumner Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 I told you guys I was watching this thread. And you HAD to interject the President into it. Those posts have been removed. One more and the poster will be removed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Manuel J. Armas S. Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Just waiting… AMK is control damage... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Roof Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 (edited) I posted this comment on Facebook earlier this morning. I've also discussed this possibility with someone very involved in the hobby and they believe it's possible based on other factors (that he did not share with me). I will again state that I am not saying this as matter of fact, it is simply speculation on my part. I'm beginning to wonder if AMK completely lost their a$$ financially on the previously released kits (MiG's, Kfir, etc) and couldn't move forward with the F-14D until the previous debt was paid off. Perhaps the Indiegogo/pre-order endeavor was to cover those debts and not for the F-14 itself. Kind of like 'robbing peter to pay paul, but now peter is broke too'. I am in no way stating this as matter of fact, nor have I heard anything to suggest this is true. It's just something I've thought about as being a *possible* situation they're in. Edited January 25, 2019 by Dave Roof Quote Link to post Share on other sites
adamitri Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 18 minutes ago, Dave Roof said: I posted this comment on Facebook earlier this morning. I've also discussed this possibility with someone very involved in the hobby and they believe it's possible based on other factors (that he did not share with me). I will again state that I am not saying this as matter of fact, it is simply speculation on my part. I'm beginning to wonder if AMK completely lost their a$$ financially on the previously released kits (MiG's, Kfir, etc) and couldn't move forward with the F-14D until the previous debt was paid off. Perhaps the Indiegogo/pre-order endeavor was to cover those debts and not for the F-14 itself. Kind of like 'robbing peter to pay paul, but now peter is broke too'. I am in no way stating this as matter of fact, nor have I heard anything to suggest this is true. It's just something I've thought about as being a *possible* situation they're in. Makes sense.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tapchan Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Well, they released some info about one test shot weaponry sprue set to be unveiled today evening. Seem like they read this topic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
xavi84 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 I can’t wait for the fyre festival style documentaries to come out about the AMK Tomcat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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